Post poor in-game relief decisions here

[bleacher_creature]

[quote:1e1a6a4ee5="teepack"]I had back-to-back games the other night where HAL brought in Nate Fields (2L, checked to avoid righthanded batters) to face Manny Ramirez, instead of bringing in Jon Leicester (9R). Two games in a row.[/quote:1e1a6a4ee5]

It's possible Nate Fields and Neal Cotts share the rights to some photos of HAL doing unspeakable things in a hotel room.

I had to dump Cotts eventually, because (other than set to mop up) there was no way to prevent the avalanch of losses that resulted from HAL using him in critical situations, when better options existed (in a DEEP PEN). Such as the ones described here.

[Essex Moosemen]

I have a team with 11 pitchers (6 rp's) I have Juan Rincon as my middle guy v. lefties but he is not set to avoid righties. He comes in in the 6th ahead by three.He gets one out and then HAL yanks him for John Leicester who promptly....uh....bends over and I blow a 5-run lead.

The ONLY special setting I had was for Leicester to avoid lefties.

Why does HAL take out my middle relief stud in a tight spot for a $.50 specialist? :evil:

[hechojazz]

Perhaps there would have been a better chance for Gagne to have replaced Fuentes before the big bomb, if your relief usage had been set to aggressive, or maybe even normal. As I understand it, HAL will tend to give the benefit of the doubt more to a pitcher on the mound when the relief usage setting is set to conservative...you're telling HAL to make changes less frequently. When you see an opponent who manages to make five pitching changes in a game, that team's probably set to aggressive...just a thought.

[bernieh]

Everyone please review the guidelines I laid out in my initial post if you want to help.

[stlouisnathan]

I guess overall the bullpen usage is okay considering. And I think it seems to be better this year than last. But there does seem to be some nonsensical moves. I have a couple of examples with one team.

ATGII, Southtown Aces, TSN 27771
All bullpen settings are on regular. D. Patterson is the designated closer against righties and he is set to avoid lefties. T. Wilks is set to mop up. No other pitchers are set to anything.

Game #126: I have a 1 - 0 lead going into 9th. P. Richert starts the inning and walks first two. D. Patterson is brought in to face L. Gehrig. Talk about living dangerously. I would have rather Richert be left in. But if HAL felt like he had to make a change, that's not the worst of it. Patterson managed to get the out. Struck him out. So now we've got two righties coming up. Just what I've got Patterson for right? But HAL pulls Patterson for T. Wilks, who is my mop up guy. As it turned out, Wilks got the outs and I won. But not good strategy I don't think.

Same team, game #135: I have 5 - 2 lead going into 9th. Richert is brought in to pitch the 9th. Good move because there are 4 lefties coming up before the pitcher's spot, then two more lefties. He walks the first guy, HAL panicks and brings in Patterson to pitch to a lefty. He walks him. After that, Dayley and Worrell give up enough hits to blow the lead. But unless Richert gets knocked around, the game never should have gotten to them.

This team has 6 relievers and fatigue is rarely a factor. Wilks has 4 saves and at least as many blown saves. How does a mop up guy get that many opportunities? I've noticed that there are some .50 pitchers that HAL likes to bring in in save situations for some reason. Knowles and T. Burns are a couple I can think of off hand.

[Detroit-Tigers]

First of all- the logic is much better this year than last. I would be satisfied just to know how it works.

- Game (2005)
- Team Name (Shea Suckers)
- Game # (132)
- What happened
Mesa taken out for LH specialists to face LH hitters
- Why you think it was a poor decision
Mesa set to avoid LHP, quick hook, Max of 1 to 2 IP in relief, Avoid before the 7th, CLose vs RH
Cerda set to avoid RHP, quick hook, Max of 1 to 2 IP in relief, Avoid before the 8th
Walker set to avoid RHP, quick hook, Max of 1 to 2 IP in relief, Avoid before the 9th, CLose vs LH
All settings regular/normal

- What you think would've been better
Leave Mesa in for all the RHs? (At least until Pujols, if not the 9th?)

*** BOTTOM OF INNING 8 ***
SUBSTITUTE P - Jose Mesa
0 A.Soriano 6 Line Out b-0
1 L.Matos 6 Ground Out b-0
SUBSTITUTE P - Jaime Cerda
2 J.Posada 2 Single b-1
2 1 A.Pujols 7 Single 1-2 b-1
SUBSTITUTE PR- Kaz Matsui
2 12 A.Dunn 5 Line Out b-0
*** BOTTOM OF INNING 9 ***
0 L.Ford 6 Walk b-1
0 1 B.Mueller 6 Walk 1-2 b-1
SUBSTITUTE P - Jamie Walker
0 12 R.Furcal 4 Single 2-3 1-2 b-1
0 123 E.Valent 4 Walk 3-H 2-3 1-2 b-1
0 123 A.Soriano 1 Ground Out Double Play 3-H 2-3 1-o b-0
2 3 L.Matos 6 Home Run 3-H b-H

[PAULMINICUCCI]

Game (ATG II, 2005, etc.)

Strat 2005

- Team Name

NorCal Baseball 5

- Game # (1-162)

Game 68


- What happened

It is the top of the ninth. Estes (who is terrific in pitcher parks-never knew that) pitched a fine game a three hit one unearned run game, we are up 3 to 1. HAL pulls Estes, a great decision, I have Estes set to 6 innings max, and he has thrown 131 pitches. So HAL looks at the opposition line-up and sees LH Blalock and puts in Ray King. Perfect. Blalock gets a single, on first. Texiera up. He pulls King and puts in Hoffman, my closer. My closer is at “normal” and Hoffman is listed as closer for both sides. Okay. Not what I would have done see below. Tex lines out. One away. Now it gets strange. HAL puts in Walker to face Burnitz, who flies out. Then HAL pulls Walker and sends in Brower, my worst BP option to face RH Rodriquez who is an E hitter. He singles, then Brower gives up another single to Beltran. Glanville runs for Rodriquez. Then Hansen pinch hits for Renteria. He walks loading the bases. Mabry is up, wild pitch and run scores to tie. Walk Mabry INT and he gets out of the inning retiring Hernandez.



-
-
- Why you think it was a poor decision

Okay. First the obvious, why lift Hoffman? Well it seems he pitched 1/3 inning (11 pitches) in game 67. He gave up 2 hits in a 2-0 loss. In that game he relieved Peavy after 7 who was fatigued, but instead of using King first he goes to the closer in a non-close situation. Now before you say “Well you had the setting at normal and that’s what HAL does,” bear with me. I had been frustrated because HAL had been using Sanchez at every turn. I had Hoffman set as closer for both sides but with a setting of “maximize.” Hoffman had pitched in less than ten innings and King less than that. Meantime HAL has used Dauner Sanchez and Mesa to a ridiculous point (in IMO).

Here is Sanchez’s line, and he had six blown saves.

TOTAL 24 5 3 5 32.1 54 21 21 15 5.84 2.32
-
- I was so frustrated at HAL using Sanchez in one save situation after another and every other situation, I wanted to get Hoffman more work. I have Hoffman at 1-2 innings max and do not use before 8th.

So, I thought HAL could have used King the previous night, he did use him, but not after using Hoffman first even though King is a set-up man and Hoffman the closer. The other point is that Hoffman had pitched a total of 2 innings in eight appearances in the past 18 games, not exactly over-worked and a vacation compared to Sanchez. Brower had gotten shelled in game 66, yes I know the sim doesn’t use that info it only knows the 2004 stats.

Now I had just gotten Brower by dropping Mesa, who HAL just loves. His stats are as follows:


TOTAL 36 1 4 2 35.1 46 21 13 18 5.35 1.67

So I said hell, Sanchez and Mesa have pitched in 60 combined games in 68 played. They kept getting shelled. So frustration got the better part of me. King and Hoffman get overlooked.

So back to game 68. So lifting Hoffman was bad decision. He has aC6 rating, seems to me he is not fatigued even having appeared in game 67. It is also a clear case for the closer to be in. Also, HAL does not have a lot of options left. He has Brower and Walker. It seems like he needs to be more conservation oriented here, so he doesn’t run out of pitchers in a close game. As it is Brower had to finish the game and we lost 6-3. The frustration is this is a team with good defense, great ERA, I get a great game from Estes and I have confidence that Hoffman would have gotten the job done. Brower was not listed in my settings, Hoffman as the closer.

- (relevant settings; game situation; bullpen rest status) see above.
-
- What you think would've been better

He should have either stuck with King. Texiera is a 1L and Burnitz on deck, I would have let King go one more hitter, especially with Burnitz on deck or brought in Hoffman and let him pitch. Going to Walker would not have been my choice. I might have used Walker before King, but this is a set-up situation so using King makes sense.

So I dropped Brower and Sanchez and have Ortiz who is serviceable in relief. Azcevedo is being “hidden” I admit.

Part of the frustration is I am finally getting good at this dang game, have all five of my teams in first place, one by nine and one by seven and this PetCo team started great. I used a lot of analysis in putting it together, and you can see it is hitting .288 after 68 games and in second place in hitting stats for the league. I think that’s fabulous. Unfortunately it has lost a bunch of one and two run games late in the game. So, trying to conserve my lead makes me a bit edgy.

One thing I have been dying to say is that you should really look at the overall proclivity of HAL to use certain RPs. I have Mesa on a bunch of teams and HAL uses him all the time. Yan is another one who has been great for me. Walker and Witasick as well.

I am not saying HAL always messes up but sometimes it is inexplicable.

Another thing that would be great is to get a thread going with some of the vets like Marcus, Biomechanical, PBTR, etc. and do a “Guide to Relief Pitching in Strat.”

Thanks for letting us get a chance to vent.

[2cityfan]

Please see relief pitching decisions below:

http://fantasygames.sportingnews.com/baseball/stratomatic/2005/playoffs/boxscore.html?group_id=10123&g_id=979

Team Name = White Sox
2005 Season
Semi Finals Game 4

Please see the decisions made in the bottom of the 9th.. why did HAL replace Foulke after 4 pitches? he is my closer in a 1-run game?

[geekor]

probably not the place, but THIS should not be allowed to happen anymore. this is just gaming the game too much!

http://fantasygames.sportingnews.com/baseball/stratomatic/atg2/team/team_other.html?user_id=99927

no relief innings being used, except in extra inning games. Only using 4 pitchers for the entire season should NEVER be allowed.

[stlouisnathan]

ATGII, TSN 29651, Cooperstown Allstars

Game #90:
Have a 4 - 3 lead going into 7th. Starter is still in. Leadoff man reaches on error. Starter is then pulled who is a 9-inning starter so fatigue not a factor. Maybe a little premature but not too big a deal. HAL puts in Richert. This is a good move since Richert is my setup v. lefties and there are two lefties coming up. Richert gets out of 7th no problem. My team scores two in bottom of 7th so now I'm up 6 - 3. In 8th with 2 on and one out. I should say that whole bullpen is available. None fatigued. J. Bench coming up, HAL puts in Kerfeld who is my closer against righties. It's an okay move although D. Patterson is the designated set up v. righties and is available. Kerfeld gets Bench. A lefty pinch hitter is sent up, HAL puts in Bahnsen. I can live with that. Bahnsen gets out of inning.

I score 3 more in bottom of 8th, now I'm up 9 - 3. In 9th the opposition has 5 of 6 batters coming up that are lefties. T. Martinez is my designated closer against lefties. Martinez hasn't pitched in 8 games. He and Patterson are now the only two available. So HAL puts in Patterson who is the set up v. righties and is set to avoid lefties. And yes, the first two batters are lefties. The other team scores 4 runs off Patterson. HAL never did put in Martinez. I got out of it with a win but it is an example of poor management.