What Barry Bonds Should Do After #754 (o/t)

[Terry101]

It is not that I don't welcome the debate, I just think think is probably the wrong forum.

You are saying there is racism in this country. Unquetionably true. You talk about the perception of surly McGwire vs surly Bonds and the hate mail as if that has something to do with the "reason" people are now on Bond's case. I will not argue that Bond has not been the subject of racism, I will argue that the problem he is getting now is because he cheated. I am arguing that the same critizism would be being leveled at McGwire now if he were chasing the record. I am stating not that there is or was no racism against blacks, but that his problems stem from cheating and to disrespect him doesn't mean racism.

Three players late in their careers all of the sudden have a power explosion unprecedented in history and all three later to have used steroids and then to say that steroids may not provide any meaningful advantage iseems weird- just from a common sense standpoint. Just read about bodybuilders who say that with steroids they became stronger and bigger than they ever thought possible. Bonds, Sosa and McGwire exploded BECAUSE they were alreaqdy elite players; steroids took them to another level. The non-elite athlete would not benefit as much.

Yes I agree his greatness remains unchallenged. And, his smallness as a person is surely a separate issue. I think he is a great player, but those that question anything about him are not necessarily racist. You are the one who said that they were- you are not seeing that people like my sons do not like Bonds- not because he is black but because he cheated. You see racism within the critizism. I don't.

Our major difference is that you see racism in critizism of Bonds, but I don't believe you see racism in a black person's critizism of Ruth. In order for there to be racism you would have to believe that people are critizing Bond's breaking of the record because he is black. I do not believe for the vast majority of fans, that is true. Again, I do not want to see Bonds break the record because he cheated, I don't give a crap if he is surly or meek.

There is little chance that I am going to see it your way and the same must be true for you. You can give me a shot on these boards or by email, but at some point it will get old.

[teamnasty]

This last reply of yours is well thought out and I agree with the bulk of it. The one aspect I do not own up to is the claim that I said all criticism of Bonds was motivated by racism. I never said that nor do I think that. An undercurrent of it is however.

[Terry101]

Fair enough. team nasty, good luck in Strat.

[chasenally]

Baseball has had many changes throughout time. Many diifferent eras have brought different results. Those that follow the game will know how everything has played out. From the time the catcher was well beyond home plate and caught the ball on a bounce to give baserunners a better chance to steal to the day when roids helped save baseball after the strike. The problem here is that the Homerun record is a stake. Just like the time when Maris broke the single season record and Aaron broke the all time record. Now Bonds will break the all time record and everyone has a opinion on why he is not as good as the last one that did. Those that know better still bought tickets and those that don't bought tickets also. This game will stand the test of time because everyone buys tickets for different reason. See the ball blasted out of the yard and into the sea and those that watch it for the players that give everything they got everyday. This sport is no different then any other during this time. Entertain me, I have paid big bucks for my ticket and my hotdog. Kill yourself but give me a great game. When records are about to be broken that's when we call foul. Who cares if he breaks the record Hank Aaron dosen't. He knows where he stands and Babe Ruth is dead.

[CATom]

IS, kinda, a MLB story!!!! :lol:

Just seen a story on Barry on ESPN (before the game tonight in which he may TIE AND/OR break the record) AND I'll tell ya what - Barry had NO explosion of SIZE as alot pf ya wanna think - They showed him in '93 he was smaller but in'97 you can see where he is getting ALOT bigger (isn't this BEFORE the accused steriod use)? - and again in '03 he was bigger yet! Ya know, damn same thing is happening to ME - I was a hellofva' lot "smaller" in '93 than I am NOW! Guess I'm on the Juice, TOO!!! (yeah, beer, wine and vodka) :lol: Bonds vs. Willis ------

GO BARRY !!!!!

[BRIANSIELSKI]

[quote:cb3d199502]Mantle's rookie card commands a much higher price than Mays' does, even though Mays had the longer, better career. What accounts for this? [/quote:cb3d199502]

It's not racism ... Mantle's Card demands more money because he was a New York Yankee. May's card demands less because more people want Mantle's card. It's obvious to me... it is supply and demand.

[visick]

I've got tickets to the game tonight and will clapping if/when the record is tied or broken.

I may be alone but I could care less.

I wonder if the fans who were cheering for McGwire and Sosa are the same fans who are now booing Bonds? :roll:

Go, innocent until proven guilty of something, Bonds :!:

[nythawk129921]

I personally have never been a Bonds fan.I just do not like the player that is selfish and all about "me".He does not give a damn about his fans or anyone else except himself.The sad thing about his chase for the record is what little regard he has for the game itself.The "only"effort he makes on the field is when he is at bat trying to his the history making homerun.The guy never hustles anymore especially when coming out of the box.It really is a joke and a sad commentary to where the game is today when nobody seems to care about how he plays the game.I dont really care to hear about his leg problems and such.Back in the day everyone hustled and if they didnt they sat on the bench.He sure is no role model as far as I am concerned.I am just hoping he breaks the record sooner rather than later so that the spotlight will get back to the teams and players that are the ones worth talking about and the ones that the focus should be on

[MICHAELTARBELL]

[quote:f0f6dc65f0]With due respect to Ken Griffey Jr., a first ballot hall of famer if I ever saw one, the guy's prime years didn't hold a candle to Bonds' performance at the same time, all of which is considered pre-roid by overwhelming consensus.[/quote:f0f6dc65f0]

1992 to 2000

Griffey Jr.
Games – 1244
HRs- 378
RBIs – 1029
BA – 293
OBP – 384
SLG – 591
Gold Gloves - 8

Bonds
Games – 1273
HRs – 352
RBIs – 952
BA – 302
OBP – 438
SLG - 626
Gold Gloves - 2

Now, Griffey's OBP is considerably lower. However, i do not see by these stats that Jr "does not hold a candle to Bonds". More HRs, More RBI's and in less games than Barry. Not to mention 8 gold gloves in CF (a much more crucial and difficult position in the outfield) to 2 for Barry in Lf.

Griffey also had 2 seasons (1995 and 1996) where he played 111 games and 72 games respectfully. (he hit 40 hrs in 111 games in 1995!) and in 1996 batted only 258 due to injuries. So these two seasons seriously affect his numbers, but still staggering statistics! :) :wink:

[teamnasty]

A 54-point gap in onbasepercentage when comparing two full time players over a 9 year-span is, well, overwhelming. Oh yeah, he outslugged Griffey too. Oh yeah, he was faster too. Oh yeah, he played in Candlestick while Griffey played in the homer (king) dome. It's not close folks, not close.