Archive of SportingNews.com's old SOM Baseball forum

The 2012 HOF ballot is out, and it's a pretty weak class of first-year candidates, which opens the door for others who've been passed over before. And maybe a last chance before the tsunami hits next year.


2012 Hall of Fame Ballot

Jeff Bagwell, 1B
Jeromy Burnitz, OF *
Vinny Castilla, 3B *
Juan Gonzalez, OF
Brian Jordan, OF *
Barry Larkin, SS
Javy Lopez, C *
Edgar Martinez, 3B/DH
Don Mattingly, 1B
Fred McGriff, 1B
Mark McGwire, 1B
Jack Morris, RHP
Bill Mueller, 3B *
Terry Mulholland, LHP*
Dale Murphy, OF
Phil Nevin, 3B/1B *
Rafael Palmeiro, 1B
Brad Radke, RHP *
Tim Raines, OF
Tim Salmon, OF *
Ruben Sierra, OF *
Lee Smith, RHP
Alan Trammell, SS
Larry Walker, OF
Bernie Williams, OF *
Tony Womack, 2B/SS *
Eric Young, 2B *
* -- first year on ballot.

Remember, you can have up to 10 names on your list, voting for none as a symbolic protest of the Steroid Era will be ignored, as will a write-in vote for Pete Rose. 75% needed for selection, who do you like?

You're certainly allowed to cast a blank ballot in the real voting. (If you just never send it back, then it doesn't count, but if you send it back blank, it's a vote against everybody.)

That said... Bagwell, Larkin, E. Martinez, McGriff, McGwire, D. Murphy, Raines, Trammell, L. Walker, B. Williams. I believe in voting for 10 guys and let God (in the form of probability) sort 'em out. I vote for McGwire and not Palmeiro because McGwire manned up and admitted it, while I believe Palmeiro still claims he took B-12 or whatever nonsense. (I also find it hard to believe that one era had about a dozen 1B/DH HOF candidates all going simultaneously.)

I always thought Raines was real good. Just under a .300 BA, .385 OBP, 800+ steals less than 150 CS, a good fielder with some pop in his bat. What more could you ask from a leadoff hitter? Trammel and Larkin also deserve some consideration for their offensive proess as great fielding middle IF's before it became common. Middle IF's get screwed in the HOF voting. Play the 70's game or the '69 game and see what you get at SS.

this is the "Keltner List" Bill James put together.
1.Was he ever regarded as the best player in baseball? Did anybody, while he was active, ever suggest that he was the best player in baseball?
2.Was he the best player on his team?
3.Was he the best player in baseball at his position? Was he the best player in the league at his position?
4.Did he have an impact on a number of pennant races?
5.Was he a good enough player that he could continue to play regularly after passing his prime?
6.Is he the very best player in baseball history who is not in the Hall of Fame?
7.Are most players who have comparable career statistics in the Hall of Fame?
8.Do the player's numbers meet Hall of Fame standards?
9.Is there any evidence to suggest that the player was significantly better or worse than is suggested by his statistics?
10.Is he the best player at his position who is eligible for the Hall of Fame but not in?
11.How many MVP-type seasons did he have? Did he ever win an MVP award? If not, how many times was he close?
12.How many All-Star-type seasons did he have? How many All-Star games did he play in? Did most of the other players who played in this many go to the Hall of Fame?
13.If this man were the best player on his team, would it be likely that the team could win the pennant?
14.What impact did the player have on baseball history? Was he responsible for any rule changes? Did he introduce any new equipment? Did he change the game in any way?
15.Did the player uphold the standards of sportsmanship and character that the Hall of Fame, in its written guidelines, instructs us to consider?

Trammell, Larkin- (different ballgame back then)

McGwire-Despite steroid use, numbers are there and was always an ambassador of the game, not to mention he (with Sosa and Ripken) save the game from extiction after the strike

Bagwell, Martinez, Morris, Raines

Some of these guys (ok, all but McGwire and Raines) wouldn't be on my ballot but for what slop is already in there. I've always been of the mind that only the truly "greats" should be in there.

It should be noted that Mattingly and Puckett have near identical stats. Mattingly was always considered one of the elite players of his era, one of the feared hitters of his time and gold gloves to boot, yet he never comes remotely close.

I like the dea of voting for 10 guys.

1.Barry Larkin
2.Fred McGriff
3.Jack Morris
4.Dale Murphy
5.Tim Raines
6.Lee Smith
7.Alan Trammell
8."Shoeless" Joe Jackson

You said no write in votes for Rose butsaid nothing about Jackson.

These last 2 depend on the day you ask me

9. Mark McGwire
10. Don Mattingly

If we were allowed to write in Rose I would.

[quote:a1de2ba64c]You said no write in votes for Rose butsaid nothing about Jackson. [/quote:a1de2ba64c]The Hall of Fame's rules (now) state that players on the "permanently ineligible" list cannot be elected.

Mark McGwire
Tim Raines
Lee Smith

Thats it

There's not a chance in Hades that a juicer would get my vote before Pete Rose is accepted in for what he did on the playing field.

Raines was a force, a game changer with his OBA and speed. I understand the SS/2B argument, but eventhough Mark Belanger was great...he's not getting my vote for the HOF.

Larkin and Trammell were special men in addition to what they did on the field. For me they are shoe-ins.

I want to say McGwire too but I think the problem there is that we're still in the cleaning out stage of PED use/users. Therefore it's tough for me to accept McGwire into a place (HOF) that demands something extraordinary in the literal sense. And in the sense that McGwire participated in, and benifitted greatly from, steroid use he has proven himself quite run of the mill and average indeed. Basically speaking, McGwire didn't prove himself above the rest with his steroid usage. Quite the contrary. You could argue his career performance is a direct product of the steroid era. Why would I choose to celebrate that with a McGwire enshrinement? I would at least tacitly be enshrining and celebrating PED's themselves..."WOW, look at what steroids can do! They can make a HOFer!" NO, not for me.