24 TKL chat

[qksilver69]

Ah, but it wouldn't have helped you at all rant, you didn't have any promotable prospects, so there was no saving those guys! :P

At least, no prospects that I see on your roster now...

[Page2]

Hi,

Rants example is what I am talking about if he had been able to keep Berkman and promote a prospect that puts him in the drivers seat.

To bring that prospect up he should have to get down to the 20 guys including any call ups thus expanding the drafting pool which is already shallow.

Another note on prospects how is Yu Darvish on smokeys roster? I thought to draft someone they had to be signed by an MJB club. I think it would be a lot easier if we could just draft them if they haven't played in the majors yet. If I have watched a good high school kid or want to draft the top kid from the little league world series what does it matter if they have signed or not?

Page2

[The Turtle]

Yu Darvish was drafted and no one spoke up I guess. He is not eligible for last year's draft because he was not signed.

But, I was not in charge then and I am hesitant to make a retroactive move months later.

Looking back this was the ruling then:

ANY Player that has had ZERO (none, zilch, nada) at bats or appearances in MLB PRIOR TO the current 2011 MLB baseball season (currently underway) is eligible IF they meet these conditions:

1 - They are signed by a professional baseball organization (MLB, Japan or Independent leagues)
2 - They ARE NOT in their current MLB draft year (Gerritt Cole, Anthony Rendon, George Springer and the rest ARE NOT ELIGIBLE this year)

I am not sure I agree with that, but he does have Darvish. I can't go back and take him away. I CAN change the rule going forward.

And after the debate on prospects, I am hesitant to make a change on it. Promoting prospects does make us drop more players into the pool.

[qksilver69]

The prospect eligibility rule is unclear as written. It just says the player "must be signed prior to the start of the MLB season", but it does not say signed to an MLB club.

At this point I don't think we can penalize Smokey if no one objected to the pick at the time, but we should clarify moving forward. I did see that Chuck later clarified this on page 1 of the league thread, so Turtle, please update the language to read "signed by an MLB club prior to the start of the MLB season".

So for instance, if Cespedes signs prior to the prospect draft, he'd be eligible. Darvish should not have been, but again I don't think we can penalize Smokey now.

[qksilver69]

Guys, I hate to beat a dead horse, but Turtle I have to correct you & Page2 on points of fact. I've already shown 8 players above who WERE NOT USED LAST YEAR because they were stashed on prospect rosters. Their total card value is well over $15M. If we make the rule change, those cards expand the draft pool because 8 more total cards are in play.

Rant's example is nice in theory, but again remember:

1) he could not have taken advantage of the rule as he had no carded prospects to promote, and in any season most teams will have just 1 or 2 promotable prospects

2) the players who will be kept on 20-man instead of being dropped are bubble players - the fact that Berkman had a huge comeback year in 2011 after putting up a marginal card in 2010 and that Carlos Lee has a useful platoon DH card vs. LHPs should not sway our thinking here - at the time those were very marginal cards & players and would have been picked well past the 1st few rounds, so the hit is not to the top of the draft pool but to the bottom

So again, the impacts of the change would be:

1) make prospects more valuable
2) make it easier for teams to shorten the "down" cycle, making the league more competitive on a year-to-year basis
3) enable teams to carry more "bubble" players, those 21st or 22nd guys on the roster who you'd like to take a gamble on but most likely don't have great cards in terms of current value
4) make draft picks in the top few rounds more valuable as the draft will be shorter and shallower in terms of removing some of the "bubble" players from the pool
5) ensure that we use all valuable player cards instead of leaving prospect cards on the sidelines

Again, this is something I have seen & done in other leagues. The sky does not fall. The earth does not crumble. And Turtle, so far the only objection I have seen is 1 person. I'd prefer we get at least 3 or 4 objections before we rest this, as we've had a couple in favor and a couple of "no objections".

[Rant]

[quote:ad8a41de53="qksilver"]Rant's example is nice in theory, but again remember:

1) he could not have taken advantage of the rule as he had no carded prospects to promote, and in any season most teams will have just 1 or 2 promotable prospects[/quote:ad8a41de53]


Actually, I had two prospects that I promoted last year (Bumgarner and Carlos Santana), which is why I used the example of the last two players I decided to cut.



[quote:ad8a41de53]2) the players who will be kept on 20-man instead of being dropped are bubble players...at the time those were very marginal cards & players and would have been picked well past the 1st few rounds, so the hit is not to the top of the draft pool but to the bottom[/quote:ad8a41de53]

Not to nitpick, but Berkman was an end of first round pick last year, as he started to put up numbers at the beginning of the year in between the time I declared my drops and the time we started drafting. I say nitpick, because Berkman is the exception that proves the rule.

[Page2]

Hi,

I was not saying to take Darvish away from smokey just make it clear so we know what to do moving forward. I think anyone with no MLB time should be able to be taken that would avoid any confusion and prevent the of the Cuban OF signing during the middle of the prospect draft.

Page2

[qksilver69]

Gotcha Rant, sorry I was looking at your current prospects only, my bad.

But your case does also support what I was saying about shortening the cycle to turn a team around. If you had been able to keep Berkman & Lee, you would be in a much stronger position this year after suffering through the rebuild year.

And Page2, I agree with you, I prefer open drafting of players with no MLB experience.

[superflymacdaddyjuice]

The darvish pick was legal. He was signed to a pro japanese team and had no mlb experience. He was also not in last years draft class. So he met all three requirments. Im guessing n oneo said anything cause it passed everyone's smell test.

What do i not understand or what dis i miss?

[superflymacdaddyjuice]

Darvish is missing from my column on the combined tab. Fyi