1. We will do the sticks B4 AD once live 24 draft is done. I posted this many times (allbeit orignal intention was to do it after AD). Otherwise, we have a timing issue due to frenzy. Simpliest solution is to do it after 24 Live draft, fill in AD, first move in frenzy to add 2nd stick, then OFF to the Correction Races (aka "Roster Reconstruction").
2. You can stick one Pitcher and and one hitter. You can stick at 3rd, you can stick at Nickel. The thought behind this theme was to reward the teams that figure out a way to use the sticks. I plan on rejiggering my line-up (and left room) at DH. I made the choice to have an OPTION to lose Ted Wiliiams by playing him in the field (and DHing a stick) or just taking the salary hit on the stick. The Stick will reward creative GM's with flexible rosters. OR you can just pretend it is a 90M cap. Its up to you......
YIKES (AGAIN)!!! SHIFTING SANDS -- Dose #2
by MEAT » Sat Feb 10, 2007 1:10 pm
being in this league is penatly enough isnt it! :twisted: :roll:
agree they should be equitable, but some teams are in such dire straits, even after rd. 24, that just fixing them is gonna be a nightmare, and nearly impossible as it is. making sure you make things that much harder on people to get in compliance doesn't really benefit any of us. imho.
agree they should be equitable, but some teams are in such dire straits, even after rd. 24, that just fixing them is gonna be a nightmare, and nearly impossible as it is. making sure you make things that much harder on people to get in compliance doesn't really benefit any of us. imho.
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by modmark46 » Sat Feb 10, 2007 1:27 pm
I personally have no interest in punishing people. This draft has been a bear. Let's just do what we can to get everyone in compliance, be as fair as we can within reason, and cut everyone some slack, if necessary. :)
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by pacoboy » Sat Feb 10, 2007 4:42 pm
[quote:a588548918]Also, AP, your recent post has deeply confused me. What exactly does this mean?
[i:a588548918]1 - Bigmahon violated the "24" Rule and made his "FIX" like most....but he then fell upon CAP issues and thus was forced into my PENALTY.
....not sure how he came upon the player he add/dropped initially and didn't select a slightly higher $ player to drop to be able to keep Hornsby....didn't follow how that played out[/i:a588548918].[/quote:a588548918]
Bigmahon, not sure what part is confusing in my statement...but it was in response to wockenfuss's comment on how he preceived your penalty being more unfair than the others.
...my first statement -[i:a588548918] [u:a588548918]Bigmahon violated the "24" Rule and made his "FIX" like most....but he then fell upon CAP issues and thus was forced into my PENALTY[/u:a588548918].[/i:a588548918] ....was simply a re-hasing of the facts....you came to a point in the draft where you were stuck, and fixed it. Is that not correct ?
...my second statement - [i:a588548918][u:a588548918]not sure how he came upon the player he add/dropped initially and didn't select a slightly higher $ player to drop to be able to keep Hornsby....didn't follow how that played out[/u:a588548918][/i:a588548918]. Was just my way of saying that I had NOT followed how or why you had to drop Hornsby...and I will dig up the pieces (like I did for the others) and if you want to see if there was a better way for you.
I do not recall who you dropped (swapped) before the Hornsby drop, but whoever it was obviously did not leave you enough $'s to continue - thus, forcing you to drop Hornsby.....correct ?
My point was that the OTHERS - who wockenfuss was biathcing at - seemed to be just cherry picking players to drop that fit their needs. Case in point was He's Meat who chose S.Miller - drafted several rounds before - rather than Reuther.
....I was just wondering WHY you did not selected a HIGHER $ player to drop (swap out) so that you could get back draft $'s to continue and still KEEP Hornsby.
I applaud you for doing the correct thing - you should NOT cherry pick - but considering the others appreared to - I just wondered out loud on the boards why you didn't. Moreover, I set out last night to see if in fact the others were as CORRECT (want to use the word honest but that's not going to sound right) in their "FIX" moves as you were.
...and I posted my opinions on each.
I did not look into yours because it was late, I was tired, and I'm sure you would not have dropped Horsnby unless you were sure it was the only option.
Did my comments seem in anyway condeming ? On the contrary, I was agreeing w/ wockenfuss
Now, the others who made changes (He's Meat, roesnthem, giddyup) I am NOT saying you did anything WRONG/UNFAIR/DISHONEST etc....
I just reacted to wockenfuss's statement - which IMPLIED that people were not a penalized as Bigmahon - and looked back on those moves.
....rules confusion aside, none of the other drafting errors put any of you in the Draft $ / Letter issue where you would have to drop your hightest $ player.
Bigmahon, if you can help me from digging up all the postings from pages and pages - just post here what happend and what you did and I'll give you my 2 cents to see if you needed to drop Hornsby
....or not. Up to you.
Just trying to help. :?
Think I'll play an UNCLE next time and go lie on a beach :D
[i:a588548918]1 - Bigmahon violated the "24" Rule and made his "FIX" like most....but he then fell upon CAP issues and thus was forced into my PENALTY.
....not sure how he came upon the player he add/dropped initially and didn't select a slightly higher $ player to drop to be able to keep Hornsby....didn't follow how that played out[/i:a588548918].[/quote:a588548918]
Bigmahon, not sure what part is confusing in my statement...but it was in response to wockenfuss's comment on how he preceived your penalty being more unfair than the others.
...my first statement -[i:a588548918] [u:a588548918]Bigmahon violated the "24" Rule and made his "FIX" like most....but he then fell upon CAP issues and thus was forced into my PENALTY[/u:a588548918].[/i:a588548918] ....was simply a re-hasing of the facts....you came to a point in the draft where you were stuck, and fixed it. Is that not correct ?
...my second statement - [i:a588548918][u:a588548918]not sure how he came upon the player he add/dropped initially and didn't select a slightly higher $ player to drop to be able to keep Hornsby....didn't follow how that played out[/u:a588548918][/i:a588548918]. Was just my way of saying that I had NOT followed how or why you had to drop Hornsby...and I will dig up the pieces (like I did for the others) and if you want to see if there was a better way for you.
I do not recall who you dropped (swapped) before the Hornsby drop, but whoever it was obviously did not leave you enough $'s to continue - thus, forcing you to drop Hornsby.....correct ?
My point was that the OTHERS - who wockenfuss was biathcing at - seemed to be just cherry picking players to drop that fit their needs. Case in point was He's Meat who chose S.Miller - drafted several rounds before - rather than Reuther.
....I was just wondering WHY you did not selected a HIGHER $ player to drop (swap out) so that you could get back draft $'s to continue and still KEEP Hornsby.
I applaud you for doing the correct thing - you should NOT cherry pick - but considering the others appreared to - I just wondered out loud on the boards why you didn't. Moreover, I set out last night to see if in fact the others were as CORRECT (want to use the word honest but that's not going to sound right) in their "FIX" moves as you were.
...and I posted my opinions on each.
I did not look into yours because it was late, I was tired, and I'm sure you would not have dropped Horsnby unless you were sure it was the only option.
Did my comments seem in anyway condeming ? On the contrary, I was agreeing w/ wockenfuss
Now, the others who made changes (He's Meat, roesnthem, giddyup) I am NOT saying you did anything WRONG/UNFAIR/DISHONEST etc....
I just reacted to wockenfuss's statement - which IMPLIED that people were not a penalized as Bigmahon - and looked back on those moves.
....rules confusion aside, none of the other drafting errors put any of you in the Draft $ / Letter issue where you would have to drop your hightest $ player.
Bigmahon, if you can help me from digging up all the postings from pages and pages - just post here what happend and what you did and I'll give you my 2 cents to see if you needed to drop Hornsby
....or not. Up to you.
Just trying to help. :?
Think I'll play an UNCLE next time and go lie on a beach :D
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by bigmahon » Sat Feb 10, 2007 5:29 pm
AP, for the record, I have no beef with you. I realize now that my post, composed before I was truly awake this morning, suggests that I question [b:799d9fde61]your[/b:799d9fde61] friendship and intentions. Not the case. It was an awkward juxtaposition on my part. Sorry for that. :wink:
I was legitimately confused by your post however. The penalty portion of your rule states very clearly that the highest salaried player is the casualty in the event of any "24" compliance issue.
And the first "fix" I made was a Pilgrim fix, and involved dropping Candelaria for Criger, which actually saved me money. So that drop was entirely unrelated to the Hornsby drop.
The Hornsby drop was all about my reading of your rule (see two paragraphs above).
I must admit, I did not realize that others were "cherry picking" (although I'm not surprised). I also didn't realize that Foggy was making a case for leniency on my behalf.
Anyway AP, sorry if I appeared angry with you. I was not. Just confused! :wink: :lol:
I was legitimately confused by your post however. The penalty portion of your rule states very clearly that the highest salaried player is the casualty in the event of any "24" compliance issue.
And the first "fix" I made was a Pilgrim fix, and involved dropping Candelaria for Criger, which actually saved me money. So that drop was entirely unrelated to the Hornsby drop.
The Hornsby drop was all about my reading of your rule (see two paragraphs above).
I must admit, I did not realize that others were "cherry picking" (although I'm not surprised). I also didn't realize that Foggy was making a case for leniency on my behalf.
Anyway AP, sorry if I appeared angry with you. I was not. Just confused! :wink: :lol:
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by pacoboy » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:41 pm
No problem Bigmahon, all's good :)
I uderstand the "24" penalty is a rough one but the reason why you were forced into in and the others were NOT is simply because:
A)The others made ILLEGAL picks which should have been voided the second they made them. (He's Meat NEVER was allowed to pick Reuther, Giddyup was NEVER allowed to pick that 2nd "K" and rosenthem actually didnt' do anything wrong - except add :P )
...and once they realized their errors they "FIXED" them and STILL had the cash left over to continue
2 - On the other hand, you "FIXED" your PILGRIM Pick yet STILL were over the cap. The "24" Penalty is SPECIFIC to the CAP and ONLY THE CAP. This was designed for the very reason that if given the choice, you would have CHERRY PICKED the player to drop to get back under the cap.
....the others never had CAP issues (well, rosenthem almost did).
Now regarding your CANDELARIA "swap". Again, not sure why or how you picked him - when he was one of your first picks - over another Pilgrim swap other than it was and easy swap (cherry picking)
Again, I do not know what PILGRIM letters were left at the time you discovered the error but I would have said that you SHOULD HAVE BEEN FORCED TO TAKE THE PILGRIM WITH A LETTER OF THE LATEST PLAYER YOU DRAFTED.
...the reason I say this is because the Candleria pick was well in the beginning when you rosters was good. It was that LATER PLAYER that you took - when Pilgrims were still on the board (are still on the board) and which you should have taken then - that should be dropped for a DIFFERENT PILGRIM.
Maybe that just leads to more non-compliance, maybe not.
..right now it's a "who cares, let's just play" deal so we move on.
Thus, that is the diff. You were CAPPED OUT and the ohters were NOT. Hence you were hit with the "24" penalty.
Cool ?
8) [/list]
I uderstand the "24" penalty is a rough one but the reason why you were forced into in and the others were NOT is simply because:
A)The others made ILLEGAL picks which should have been voided the second they made them. (He's Meat NEVER was allowed to pick Reuther, Giddyup was NEVER allowed to pick that 2nd "K" and rosenthem actually didnt' do anything wrong - except add :P )
...and once they realized their errors they "FIXED" them and STILL had the cash left over to continue
2 - On the other hand, you "FIXED" your PILGRIM Pick yet STILL were over the cap. The "24" Penalty is SPECIFIC to the CAP and ONLY THE CAP. This was designed for the very reason that if given the choice, you would have CHERRY PICKED the player to drop to get back under the cap.
....the others never had CAP issues (well, rosenthem almost did).
Now regarding your CANDELARIA "swap". Again, not sure why or how you picked him - when he was one of your first picks - over another Pilgrim swap other than it was and easy swap (cherry picking)
Again, I do not know what PILGRIM letters were left at the time you discovered the error but I would have said that you SHOULD HAVE BEEN FORCED TO TAKE THE PILGRIM WITH A LETTER OF THE LATEST PLAYER YOU DRAFTED.
...the reason I say this is because the Candleria pick was well in the beginning when you rosters was good. It was that LATER PLAYER that you took - when Pilgrims were still on the board (are still on the board) and which you should have taken then - that should be dropped for a DIFFERENT PILGRIM.
Maybe that just leads to more non-compliance, maybe not.
..right now it's a "who cares, let's just play" deal so we move on.
Thus, that is the diff. You were CAPPED OUT and the ohters were NOT. Hence you were hit with the "24" penalty.
Cool ?
8) [/list]
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by pacoboy » Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:49 pm
[quote:fffe36ccda][b:fffe36ccda]PENALTY - as I said before, and have read above, this THEME should not and WILL NOT interfere w/ any other theme....why ? Because if you come to a point in the draft were the only players available prohibit you from [u:fffe36ccda]A) meeting the other theme requirement [/u:fffe36ccda]and/or B) meeting the salary cap then you will assessed a PENALTY. The PENALTY is that starting with your highest $ Drafted player (if during the regular season when you are subject to Uncle's cut rule then you must make whatever extra cuts you need to make to adhere to this rule), you throw that player back - NEVER TO BE ACQUIRED AGAIN EVER - and make another pick at that letter (or another if still available to you)....and continue until you have met all the other theme requirements - including this one. [/b:fffe36ccda][/quote:fffe36ccda]
Slight correction in my explaination Bigmahon....but still the same result.
If someone needed a PILGRIM or an ERA or an OPPOSITE SP (like he's meat) and there WERE NONE LEFT AT THE LETTERS LEFT then he also would be subject to the penalty.
(which according to this rule says you take HUGHES for HORNSBY and forget about Candy for Cigar...but I digress) :P
....in the case of Giddyup and He's Meat - again, thier picks were illegal at the time they made them and should have been caught just like Uncle's picks were a couple of times.
He's Meat and Giddyup still had options / players / letters open / cash once they re-picked.
You were capped out w/ NO OPTIONS.
Slight correction in my explaination Bigmahon....but still the same result.
If someone needed a PILGRIM or an ERA or an OPPOSITE SP (like he's meat) and there WERE NONE LEFT AT THE LETTERS LEFT then he also would be subject to the penalty.
(which according to this rule says you take HUGHES for HORNSBY and forget about Candy for Cigar...but I digress) :P
....in the case of Giddyup and He's Meat - again, thier picks were illegal at the time they made them and should have been caught just like Uncle's picks were a couple of times.
He's Meat and Giddyup still had options / players / letters open / cash once they re-picked.
You were capped out w/ NO OPTIONS.
Last edited by pacoboy on Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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