SOM Through the Years League - Chat Thread - 2008 draft time

[visick]

I was under the assumption that this was a keeper league and the live drafted players were our keepers.

[FRANKMANSUETO]

Gotta agree with Visick on this one. We either draft 2002 players only or start the draft all over again with the understanding that we can draft FURURE players. Nice way to end the night. :x

[fowldawg]

Nowhere did it say in the directions 2002 was a must.

If thats the way it's going to be I think the players must be carded 4 of 5 years.

If that rule is not implemented, here are my public proxies for the next 6 picks:

Tim Raines
Brady Anderson
Jose Ortiz
Lee Stevens
Octavio Dotel
Jayson Durocher

Point being... you can have a worse problem for those who want to "game the game" and I'll be auto-drafting 24 or 25 players every year after 2002.

[uncle ny]

Isn't the bottom line that we all agreed to play in a league COVERING FIVE SEASONS with the expectation that we were all playing by the same rules? Geekor's instructions were ambiguous at best and misleading at worst. Isn't the right thing to do to clarify the rules and put us all on the same footing, meaning we start over or drop those two picks?

I like playing these kinds of leagues, but I don't like this kind of sh!t. Wock-fuss and I have disagreed on this point on several occasions over the years: for him "gaming the game" is part of the game--in other words, he who sees these "opportunities within ambiguities is the better player. For me the better player is the one who drafts the better teams under the rules w/o taking advantage of loopholes.

This kind of sh!t makes this whole thing a lot less fun. Start over, drop the two picks, do the right thing. Woods, fog and whoever else like the loophole leagues can start up a shifting sands leauge and loop all they want.

This wouldn't be such a big deal but the fact is that we all agreed to play FIVE LEAUGES, not one. And starting off on this foot just ain't right.

[toshiro]

Alright, since we've given the subject a solid debate and all of the issues have been given light, shall we put it to a vote?

The 3 options seem to be as follows:

A) Allow any picks (no 2002 card required)

B) Add rule that player must have cards in 4 of 5 years. 2002 card not necessary. We'll need a secondary vote for the number of non-2002 cards allowed if this passes.

C) move the draft back to Geekor's pick and start over from there , requiring all players to have a 2002 card.

I modified Geekor's working slightly to add clarity (hope I succeeded). Are these pretty clear? And do they state what Geekor intended?

Without further ado, I'll kick off the voting.

Again, let me know if there's any problem/confusion with the wording. I don't think anyone did anything to slight anyone and certainly nothing was personal, so we can ratched the emotions down a bit. It was just a bit of confusion, that's all.

But chime in if you're confused going forward. :)

[toshiro]

Uncle NY -- it seems to me that we have a myriad of different views going on with this. I think it surprised all of us because we all thought everyone was viewing it the way we (as individuals) were. Clearly not the case.

I don't think Geekor was trying to game the game. I wouldn't want to suck up that 4.2 mil 5L card he has in 2003! If he really wanted to game the game, he should have taken Howard. Or maybe Mauer.

I think we have a better understanding after the debate and can come to an accord. I the fowldawg has a good compromise solution, but it seems like it'd be appropriate to put it to a vote.

[fowldawg]

UncleNY-- I would like nothing more than to put move on with the draft and forget the misunderstandings, but I feel like geekor is being unfairly attacked. In all fairness to him, the instructions, were neither ambiguous or misleading. They were straight forward and to the point.

[quote:701dc06d66]There will be an 11 round draft for 10 players and 1 stadium. So yes you will be using the same stadium the entire time. Of the 10 players you draft, you MUST have them on your team at all times IF they have a card.[/quote:701dc06d66]

Nowhere does it say that the player must have a 2002 card. To believe all players drafted must have a 2002 card would be an assumption, not geekor's fault.

That being said, I am afraid I am going to bow out of the league. It looks like we are at a temporary impasse, and since I am leaving on vacation Wednesday morning, I would like to afford you all the opportunity to find a replacement so that you can continue on in good time once a resolution has come.

Good luck!

[james]

Will you guys cut it out. WHO CARES!!
We are killing the goose that lays the golden eggs!!!

If you guys cannot gt over this bs, you are truly pathetic.

Just draft and play. TAKE WHOMEVER YOU WANT!!! :!:

just a point to show how DUMB this is:

We will be putting our pre-selected players LAST on our draft cards!!! We will all have at least 15 draft picks from NUMBER ONE through NUMBER FIFTEEN..

WHO CARES IF SOMEONE ELSE HAS EXTRA DRAFT PICKS NUMBER 16 and 17??? We will all have taken ALL THE PRE- SELECTED PLAYERS plus OUR ROUNDS 1 through 15 picks!!!!

Wake up! Cut the pedantic crap out and draft.


:evil:

[FRANKMANSUETO]

I am for drafting 2002 cards ONLY. We can then have a futures draft and pick a player or even 2. Thats my position on this matter and am standing on this. If ANYONE has a problem you can find a replacement. Everyone here for the most part has been in leagues with me and know I am NOT one to bail. But this issue is not sitting well.

[visick]

[quote:8fba310f00]To believe all players drafted must have a 2002 card would be an assumption, not geekor's fault
[/quote:8fba310f00]

Nobody is blaming geekor for anything. I have been in numerous leagues with him and although he somehow cheats ( :lol: ) I don't think anything was done maliciously.

That being said, I guess I assumed players had to have a 2002 card. We all had to vote on which year to start. Since we voted on starting in 2002, I assumed we would draft 2002 players ONLY, keeping them as long as you can. (Assuming they are carded). Hence the Larry Walker pick. I'm sure Frank would have rather taken a 2005-2007 stud rather than have Anderson grab splinters on the bench.

It appears to me that some managers assumed you needed to pick ONLY 2002 players, while others were drafting for the future.

By drafting players NOT carded in 2002 or 2003 etc, only carded in the future, where are the keepers? Guys have to be carded right? For what 2 years? 3 years? 1 year? By drafting a Ryan Howard, Luke Scott, Francisco Liriano etc...you can have your choice of many other players in the older sets come the AD. You can use platoons with guys that you can "rent" for only a year, and not normally use. You are using players year to year rather than building a team with the same guys on it.

Every set of cards has its gems, or 1 hit wonders. Doing this gives you the option of using these players. I feel this is an unfair advantage.

Maybe there should be a choice D here. Say a 5 or 6 round draft of 2002 only players. Then you can have a draft of "Farm System" players. This is where a Ryan Howard or Joe Mauer can be drafted. Liriano or Alex Escobar etc...You get the idea.

I'm sorry here guys if some see this as a petty little problem. I don't.
Yes this is just a game. Yes I have a life. I have a wife with 2 kids and I'm opening up my 2nd. chiropractic office. Are there more important things than worrying about a draft...yes. But if I'm going to partake in some extra curricular activity, I want it to be fair WHILE I'm having fun.