Exploring an old suggestion

[geekor]

Personally I would like to see the yahoo draft style as well. To REALLY make it even better than yahoo, be able to "Tag" players at a position. Once that position is taken, any other players tagged with that tag are removed from your draft list. Only tagging for main positions (i.e starting 9) as the other positions are already done right. Couple that with the do not draft and the game would be hugely improved.

Yes it would take longer to get a team ready to draft, but the end result, for EVERYONE, would be a HUGE improvement.

[tcochran]

I second Al Hogg's idea about a "manual" draft similar to somdraft.com -- use proxies, however, instead of getting stuck with .50 players.

Even better, tie the ongoing draft to the TSN/SOM excel file, showing who has been selected and who is still available, for all to see.

And then, of course, it would be great if Bernie could help us keep track of rosters from year to year in the keeper leagues, but that's a whole 'nother topic...

[Jerlins]

Geekor, I was going to mention the tagged players as well, but decided asking for a small piece of a pie was more feasible than the whole pie itself. But yes, adding tags on positions would help incredibly as well. As mentioned originally, I'm finding myself playing fewer games and leaning towards draft and keeper leagues, and perhaps a theme league or two. I'd love to be able to do the "one team per week" like I did in previous years, but I'd like a bit more control over my original selections/and or substitutes before that happens again. Like you mentioned, it would take more time to construct your draft list, but it's a very small price to pay.

It's probably been a good year and a half anyway, since I first mentioned this suggestion. Actually, it may have been after numerous J. Edmonds substitutions for A. Jones teams in MM. Since then, while numerous drafts have left me disappointed, I always felt like even half the substitutions were at least workable. After all, EVERYONE is at the same disadvantage come draft time, and you can rarely draft "the perfect" team. But this team, with 3 cards on the extreme opposite end of the spectrum (not to mention a couple of others that while bad, is at least workable), well, I felt it time to revisit the suggestion.

[LMBombers]

I think the Yahoo style of drafting where you have to rank hundreds of players in order of preference seems very daunting.

How about a draft similar to how waivers are currently run? If your first choice is not there you don't just get a replacement player in that round but instead it drops down to your next highest requested player that is available? All substitutions would be given at the end of the draft in stead of throughout?

I don't think it is a bad system the way it currently is either for that matter. Everyone can't always get who they want. The strategy is who to draft and what order to draft them in. I find it an interesting challenge to work with (or around) the replacement players you end up with. My very first 2009 team I went with a LH slanted park (Oakland 12/3 BPHR) and missed Fielder and got Derrick Lee (3R RH hitter) instead. Lee has so much OBP vs LHP I'm thinking of keeping him at 1B even though Fielder would have been much better.

[joethejet]

Jerlins,

to play devil's advocate on your example, you have only one chance to get a 3b. If Figgin's is gone, you'll come out without a 3b. Is that better or worse? For example, in the current system, if you miss on Tulo, you might get Han Ram, Bartlett, Jeter or Scutaro, all nice to have. In your scenario, you'll end up with no SS, praying to get the one you want in waivers. And, what happens if everyone on your list is gone before you get to 25 players?

Really, the way you'd have to do it is similar to the somdraft proxy system where you can "delete group" when someone is picked, but putting in all those "what ifs" is not simple.

Perhaps a simpler solution is to couple a "don't draft list" with, maybe a couple of options on each pick.

For example, maybe you can specify which hand the replacement player hits/throws. Or, for a SP, you specify hand and * rating, for a RP, you specify hand/closer rating.

It's much simpler, doesn't take boat loads of time and *should* be not too bad to program (nice of me to speak for you eh Bernie? ;) )

What do you think about something like that?

Jet
www.angelfire.com/games5/joethejet

[Jerlins]

The answer to your question Jet, is that you of course list more than 25 players. If you don't wish to do so, by default you will end up with a 3rd baseman, that being the highest rated 3rd baseman not taken. What I believe you are doing (apologies if its not the case), is thinking that the generics of TSN's present system remain in place, which is not the case. I would ALWAYS end up with a 3rd baseman once the draft is over. I might STILL end up with Reynolds if he's the highest rated 3rd baseman available, but at least I have a fighting chance to get something I prefer. I might decide to list my top 5 choices for each position, I might prefer to list 10 for each position. Basically, the idea is to set up a master list, allowing the computer to select your highest rated player, so long as he is available, and the position is NOT filled. If it's a must every team of yours must have the best SS available, then by all means, opt for ranking SS's with your 1st 12 picks. You'll still only get your highest rated one first. The computer will then search for your "highest ranked non SS" not chosen, and selects that player, and so on.

It's not as daunting as Bombers thinks. Ranking 100 players guarantees you of getting at least 8 of your most desired players, and with the different philosophies, ballparks, salary restrictions, etc, most likely well into the teens. Only if everyones top 100 list was EXACTLY the same would you end up with just 8 (9 if your pick is 1 through 4).

I'm also assuming Bernie, correct me if I am wrong, that if you have the 1st pick in RD one, you have the 1st pick in each RD. So if I choose an order of Figgins, Crawford, and Span, and someone else opts to rank his top 3 in the exact order, and they are in no one elses top 3, player A gets all 3, player B gets hung out to dry. I'm assuming that be the case as I've seen a two players I've ranked 1 and 2 in the past on the same team, and it was not mine, which is not exactly fair either. If nothing else gets done, at least program the computer to do a serpentine draft!!!

[joethejet]

So, then you're saying that you only get one player at a position? What if I'm platooning. How do you account for that?

I'm missing something or you haven't spelled this all out. If I list 100 players in priority order, how do you m ake sure I get the right number at every position? What if my first two picks want to be A Gonz and D Lee to platoon? Sounds like it would bypass Lee if I get A Gonz.

BTW, my understanding of the draft is that if you don't get your pick, you have the highest pick next (assuming everyone else got their pick in the first round). The draft code keeps track of who has gotten the short-end the most and gives them priority in each round.

Jet
www.angelfire.com/games5/joethejet

[Jerlins]

No, not exactly, there are ways around that as well:
1. You can opt to choose to draft your highest ranked players regardless of position until the maximum is filled. You have the choice of the "tag" option, or the "highest ranked" player option.
2. These is still the dh slot to fill, the computer will select them in order regardless of either "tag" or highest rank" option.
3. You might still get Lee once your initial positions are filled. Chances are you aren't ranking your lefty part of the platoon high anyway in TSN, so I'm guessing you have as good a chance as you would in TSN of getting the other half of the platoon.

There is not a perfect auto-draft system out there, I'm not suggesting the Yahoo auto-draft is such. But it's a fairer system than the one applied presently here. You've asked answers to examples both common and extreme. So I'll ask and answer two of my own.

1. In a worse case scenario, is it possible to get ZERO players you listed in TSN's draft system? Yes! It's possible that if by some unlucky chance, each of the 25 players you listed is listed one rank higher than you did by one of the other 11 managers, leaving you with no player you had on your list.

2. In a worse case scenario, is it possible to get ZERO players you listed in Yahoo's draft system? No, even if you choose to list only 25 players, you would still get at least 2 players, and in that extreme, your 12th and 24th player ranked. The more you rank, the more you get.

Again, due to salary restrictions, park slants and team makeup, chances are very good listing 100 players would yield you a good 18 to 20 players on your list. I'd even be willing to test out this theory with 11 other managers in a yahoo fantasy baseball site using our salary restrictions.

[Delbird]

I don’t know if this applies or is maybe similar to what is being presented, but many years ago when I was playing Strat by mail, we filled out a draft sheet by position, where we listed the top 20 or so players at each position, then our draft order was filled out with a position to select, not a player (ie. SS, 2B, CF, etc.). If you want to get a shortstop first, it will take the top shortstop on your list, based on the order you (not the computer) ranked the players at that position (which may mean it wasn’t even their primary position). This means you control how it looks for the players at that position, rather than it being the next available. This sort of gives you a ‘do not draft’ list by really providing a list of your preferred choices at each position - it gives you more control of the order. You could even have it so that, if you decide you only like 5 shortsops, you only list 5, and if all are off the list, it could then go to the next position in your sequence, moving the shortstop position to the end (at which point you’ll get one, but it at that point it would be the next available since your list was depleted). So I guess this approach is rank ordering by position and then sequencing your draft by position. This very well may be similar to the approach being discussed where you rank 100 players in sequence but this discussion just flashed me back to the way we did it many years ago and it seemed to work okay. It gives control on preferences to the drafter and not the computer.

[coyote303]

[quote:f9b55f8185="Jerlins"]...

I'm also assuming Bernie, correct me if I am wrong, that if you have the 1st pick in RD one, you have the 1st pick in each RD. So if I choose an order of Figgins, Crawford, and Span, and someone else opts to rank his top 3 in the exact order, and they are in no one elses top 3, player A gets all 3, player B gets hung out to dry. I'm assuming that be the case as I've seen a two players I've ranked 1 and 2 in the past on the same team, and it was not mine, which is not exactly fair either. If nothing else gets done, at least program the computer to do a serpentine draft!!![/quote:f9b55f8185]

I'm pretty certain it's random who gets any one pick if two people pick the same player in the same round. So, a manager might get all three in your scenario, but it would be more likely a 2-1 or 1-2 split.