SOM Online update: growth initiatives, ATG, Mystery Card...

[PotKettleBlack]

[quote:505244923a="nevdully's"][quote:505244923a]Respectfully, Strat has an inherent difference from your business (Chiropractic, if I recall). It's called churn. Or burnout. It's natural for a certain percentage of players of ANY game to play once and decide it's not for them. It's also natural for a certain number of players to play for a while, lose interest and move on. And it's also natural for people to become hard core enthusiasts. With a medical service that improves a condition but doesn't cure it, like Chiro, the churn will be a lot less severe than with a game. Way of the world[/quote:505244923a]

I don't think this is entirely accurate..If in Chiro you lower your prices I doubt the customers would greatly increase their visits, not like the hardcore here would buy more teams.

Also as for burnout or other reasons for leaving *as far as we know from the printed word here*....price, price, price is the top 3 reasons people stop or cut way back...Sure there are a bunch of other reasons also but rarely do we read *burnout* is why someone leaves...If the game improvements, not just throwing more cards on top of more cards came at a more regular interval the few that leave from burnout would be tempted to stay....even the biggest group leaving (price) would be tempted to stay....Attract more,customers sure? But keeping your base customers is key.

No one, well just a few, are as hardcore as I, and I'm cutting way back (only 1 new team in two weeks, and only going to play using credits) in part due to price and in part due to long periods of stagnant game development.[/quote:505244923a]

I agree that medical services are less price sensitive than entertainment purchases. Conceded.

The reason you see more hard core players leave citing price, and no one citing burnout we could call "The Flounce Principle." Flouncing is essentially writing a screed then declaring that you're leaving. Which is what people who are leaving because of price are doing. Flouncing. When I burned out towards the start of ATG V, I did not flounce, because, well, when you're bored with something, you don't feel the need to flounce. When I got annoyed with some people on a board I used to frequent, I flounced. Because I was annoyed.

But, let's ask a deeper question on the "why do people leave" question? I still don't buy price, entirely, because the people who are flouncing off with price are people who have invested hundreds of dollars in playing and the price hasn't changed. So, when someone like Rabid Wolverines or Palanion says they're hanging up over price, what's really changed is their VALUATION of the product. A player's valuation determines whether they think $20 is a bargain or a rip off. When I burned out before, I could have cited money, because really, the value wasn't there for me at the time. But really, I was burnt out.

Yeah, circumstances change (especially in an economy like this), but when someone says it's now too expensive, what I think they are really saying is:
1- My circumstances have changed and I'm cutting back
2- I'm annoyed with the lack of progress/responsiveness/customer service, so my valuation has changed.
3- I'm kind of bored/frustrated with the game/my results.

There's nothing TSN can do about #1 and #3. And while I think Bernie does a good job, I think TSN has under resourced Strat, probably due to the niche appeal, relative to fantasy football, basketball, and baseball. But if it's cost effective, Bernie could use another body to address #2. Which would put a semi-permeable patch on the proverbial hole at the bottom of the bucket.

[PotKettleBlack]

[quote:0f7aeab282="The Rabid Wolverines"]Now, realize that there is virtually zero marketing and advertising for SOM. How many people play regular season fantasy baseball? Thousands? Hundreds of thousands? A million or more? Target advertising toward this group thru the Sporting News magazines, cross market on other websites, a sign at minor league and major league stadiums.

Also, if TSN is getting an ad for Gillette, have Gillette put a bannner on their website as well, etc. If TSN is paying MLB for the rights to use player stats, it should be in the agreement that SOM gets a banner on the MLB websites for each team.

If TSN converts just a small percentage of this regular season audience, its customer base will increase dramatically. Sure, it may not be hundreds of thousands, but I don't think 2,000-3000 near term (over the course of the next year) and 5,000-10,000 longer term are unreasonable goals.

[b:0f7aeab282]THINK SMALL, be small...

think big...BE BIG[/b:0f7aeab282][/quote:0f7aeab282]

[b:0f7aeab282][size=18:0f7aeab282]Exactly![/size:0f7aeab282][/b:0f7aeab282]

[visick]

I'm not saying TSN should do it again, though it would be nice, but what happened to the customer base after the FREE 1986 season?

Bernie?

[nevdully's]

[quote:331fd12689]1- My circumstances have changed and I'm cutting back
[/quote:331fd12689]

I do believe they can and should address #1....Ask any business owner in this economy, if they've run more sales than ever before...Crazy not to imo.

[TRW]

[quote:7f2d587a86="nevdully's"][quote:7f2d587a86]1- My circumstances have changed and I'm cutting back
[/quote:7f2d587a86]

I do believe they can and should address #1....Ask any business owner in this economy, if they've run more sales than ever before...Crazy not to imo.[/quote:7f2d587a86]


[size=23:7f2d587a86][b:7f2d587a86]Exactly! [/b:7f2d587a86][/size:7f2d587a86]

[nevdully's]

History shows us, well me anyway, that they'll do as little as possible to forward the growth of this game, both in bringing in new customers and holding on to existing ones. [b:db7e46aa08]Almost all the improvements here,[u:db7e46aa08] including this current thread[/u:db7e46aa08] (TRW push to get answers and whatever it leads to), is initiated [u:db7e46aa08]only when there is a swell of customer dissatisfaction brought to these boards[/u:db7e46aa08][/b:db7e46aa08]....Sad but usually true.

[geekor]

Well, I'll mention it again even though it will never come to be, but I still wish they would make a quick play league. As Palanion stated, for me the best part is creating a team, not so much the in-season actual games.

I would love a league where the preseason is exactly the same as now. But then on day 1 of the season 1/4 of the games play, day 2 another 1/4, etc etc. 1 playoff series (yes all 7 games) also run 1 /day. preseason 1 week, rest of season 1 week. Don't keep the boxscores as they take too much room server side, but still Fa changes can be made after each of the first 1/4's are played.

There are quite a few people like us out there that crave the pre-season not the regular. In fact I started in strat football, not baseball. The old 2001 playoff only series for like $5-10 was how I started in strat baseball in fact, and did that like 3-4 times before I ever played a real league.

If they did a quick play season for say $10-15 a pop, it's a cheaper alternative for guys who have a low budget and newbies to get their feet wet. For a guy who used to have 25-35 teams a season, who now has 4-6 it would have me coming back here a lot more tbqh.

[Palanion]

[quote:1d5223af05] So, when someone like Rabid Wolverines or Palanion says they're hanging up over price, what's really changed is their VALUATION of the product.

Yeah, circumstances change (especially in an economy like this), but when someone says it's now too expensive, what I think they are really saying is:
1- My circumstances have changed and I'm cutting back
2- I'm annoyed with the lack of progress/responsiveness/customer service, so my valuation has changed.
3- I'm kind of bored/frustrated with the game/my results. [/quote:1d5223af05]

#1 is true, and TSN [i:1d5223af05]can [/i:1d5223af05]address this. But valuation is the key, though not in how PKB put it above.

I can spend $22 for a SADV season for the Strat computer game and play it more than once--I can couple it with other seasons I've purchased, I could set it up as a draft league and create all new teams, I could play it as-played, I can do waht-if scenarios, I can QuickPlay it, I can manage every out of every game, etc. That's a lot of play (and replay) for $22. That's great value. Here, for $20/$25, I get one season, so I want the maximum value possible out of it, which means the preseason/strategy stuff.

Let me put it this way: in this TSN format, more cards in ATG do nothing for me, it lessens the game IMO. I'm a strategy guy; the more players, the less strategy in team creation. However, when bullpen v2 came out it added a layer of strategy that had been missing, and I played more. When some people came up with the concept of auction drafts, which are/were awesome, I played more. My long-time ATG keeper league uses a limited (and ever-changing) player pool, which keeps me playing here.
If TSN decided to not add more game/strategy enhancements, rather only add new cards, then I would want the price to be dropped. The value of the product is not worth the current price, particularly in this economy IMO.
If TSN actually moves forward on some of the ideas that involve subsets, modifiable subsets, autodraft leagues (or fair league-wide QuickDraft capabilities), randomized player pools, add/drop in trade offers, keeper league services, salary caps for live drafts, etc.--all things that affect strategy and team creation, then the VALUE of the product increases to justify the price. Great value.

Lastly, I was a little burned out once a few years ago, a couple months after the free 1986 offer (made too many of those teams). Otherwise, I've never burned out on the game. I've just felt the game itself became stagnant.

[Jake Squid]

[quote:3421b7c231]I'm not saying TSN should do it again, though it would be nice, but what happened to the customer base after the FREE 1986 season?
[/quote:3421b7c231]

That's what got me started. Until the '86 replay, which I heard about due to a blogger I read managing one of the teams, I had no idea that this game existed online. I'd been playing the board game for 33 years and would've jumped on an online version where I could play against others had I known about it earlier.

TSN definitely has to advertise this game better than they have been.

[geekor]

[quote:a0f4d2979c="Jake Squid"]
TSN definitely has to advertise this game better than they have been.[/quote:a0f4d2979c]

You think? Go ahead and hit the "FANTASY" link at the very top of the page. You know what you see?

[img:a0f4d2979c]http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/geekor/som.jpg[/img:a0f4d2979c]

Yea, they can't even have the TSN site with up to date information, you really think advertising to get others here is going to work?