Hack Wilson in LF?

[nevdully's]

[b:a11723f09d]At the plate[/b:a11723f09d]

Gaedel entered the second half of the doubleheader between the Browns and Detroit Tigers in the bottom of the first inning as a pinch-hitter for leadoff batter Frank Saucier. Immediately, umpire Ed Hurley called for Browns manager Zack Taylor. Veeck and Taylor had had the foresight to have a copy of Gaedel's contract on hand,[5] as well as a copy of the Browns' active roster, which had room for Gaedel's addition.

The contract had been filed late in the day on Friday, August 17. [b:a11723f09d]Veeck knew the league office would summarily approve the contract upon receipt, and that it would not be scrutinized until Monday, August 20.[/b:a11723f09d] Upon reading the contract, Hurley motioned for Gaedel to take his place in the batter's box. (As a result of Gaedel's appearance, all contracts must now be approved by the Commissioner of Baseball before a player can appear in a game.) The change to that day's St. Louis Browns scorecard, listing Gaedel and his uniform number, had gone unnoticed by everyone except Harry Mitauer, a writer for the St. Louis Globe-Democrat. The Browns' publicity man shunted Mitauer's inquiry aside.[4]

Gaedel was under strict orders not to attempt to move the bat off his shoulder. When Veeck got the impression that Gaedel might be tempted to swing at a pitch, the owner warned Gaedel that he had taken out a $1 million insurance policy on his life, and that he would be standing on the roof of the stadium with a rifle prepared to kill Gaedel if he even looked like he was going to swing.[4] Veeck had carefully trained Gaedel to assume a tight crouch at the plate; he had measured Gaedel's strike zone in that stance and claimed it was just one and a half inches high.[4] However when Gaedel came to the plate, he abandoned the crouch he had been taught for a pose that Veeck described as "a fair approximation of Joe DiMaggio's classic style,"[4] leading Veeck to fear he was going to swing. (In the Thurber story, the midget cannot resist swinging at a 3-0 pitch, grounds out, and the team loses the game).

With Bob Cain on the mound - laughing at the absurdity that he actually had to pitch to Gaedel[4] - and catcher Bob Swift catching on his knees, Gaedel took his stance. The Tigers catcher offered his pitcher a piece of strategy: "Keep it low." Cain delivered four consecutive balls, all high (the first two pitches were legitimate attempts at strikes; the last two were half-speed tosses). Gaedel took his base (stopping twice during his trot to bow to the crowd) and was replaced by pinch-runner Jim Delsing. The 18,369 fans gave Gaedel a standing ovation.
[edit] Baseball reaction

[b:a11723f09d]Veeck had hoped that Delsing would go on to score in a one-run Browns victory, but he ended up stranded at third base and the Tigers went on to win the game 6–2. [/b:a11723f09d][b:a11723f09d]American League president Will Harridge, saying Veeck was making a mockery of the game, voided Gaedel's contract the next day.[/b:a11723f09d]
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You'll always have people try and skirt the rules or the spirit of the rules, like switching out sps before an opening night series..hell that's what gives us the need for many rules in the first place...We've read here (another post) some don't think it's a big deal because it's only a game...Some don't think it's a big deal as long as it didn't work.....Me? I'm in the minority because I think it is a big deal [b:a11723f09d]"because it is a game" [/b:a11723f09d] and whether it works or not is irrelevant to the intent...and think about it...If someone cheats "in a game" what do you think that says about their integrity?

[nevdully's]

Read his post Charlie...by having no other outfielders on his roster and "Hopefully" "Forcing" Hal to use Hack in lf.

[gkhd11a]

Yes I see that and so what? How is this different from Petrosian trying to get Babe Adams to pitch 360 innings or when he drops and changes key players after the first deadline but before the game starting time?

I see no difference, you could try and do the same with a first baseman at third base as well, the only thing that is enforced in this game is that you have to have 2 catchers, 5 starters and 3 R only relievers and at least 9 pitchers. You do not even need to set a lineup at all, it is OPTIONAL but highly recommended. You could draft 2 catchers and 11 Center fielders and see what happens, nothing would prevent it, other than the basic rule that you should try to win. I think the main rule is that you should be trying to win. IF the game allows it to occur then there is not a problem.

I would prefer if we would just open the outfielders up to give the option to do what is offered in the rules. Because somehow I think if Tony Larussa had Willie Mays and Hack Wilson on his team Hack would be playing left field.

[nevdully's]

[b:e1f2107d9a]You'll always have people try and skirt the rules or the spirit of the rules[/b:e1f2107d9a], like switching out sps before an opening night series..hell [b:e1f2107d9a]that's what gives us the need for many rules in the first place[/b:e1f2107d9a]...We've read here (another post) some don't think it's a big deal because it's only a game...Some don't think it's a big deal as long as it didn't work.....Me? I'm in the minority because I think it is a big deal "because it is a game" and whether it works or not is irrelevant to the intent...and think about it...If someone cheats "in a game" "a game"! What do you think that says about their integrity?

[nevdully's]

[quote:d7128dff98]nevdully's wrote:
I see few are concerned with the "Fact" that the computer doesn't allow for this. Rolling Eyes


[b:d7128dff98][u:d7128dff98]IF the computer doesn't allow it then how can you do it?[/u:d7128dff98][/b:d7128dff98] [/quote:d7128dff98]


[quote:d7128dff98]Read his post Charlie...by having no other outfielders on his roster and "Hopefully" "Forcing" Hal to use Hack in lf. [/quote:d7128dff98]

[quote:d7128dff98]Yes I see that and so what?[/quote:d7128dff98]

I just answered your damn question Charlie.

[gkhd11a]

Doesn't almost everyone only carry 2 catchers because if you carry 3 your backup can get injured and if you carry only 2 your backup will not get an injury? Aren't you "forcing" Hal to play your backup without threat of injury? Yet in real baseball noone would do this as to have your backup catcher go down would result in utter disaster for a team. Where is the rule for that? Oh yeah the rules actually state if an injury role comes up he'd be injured but we can "FORCE" HAL to change that rule.

How is THAT any different????

And the "smart" and "experienced" players exploit this over newbies all the time.

[nevdully's]

[quote:184801839e]I would prefer if we would just open the outfielders up to give the option to do what is offered in the rules.[/quote:184801839e]

Our customer creed.

Sure open it up..If not, trick it...or force it..remember it's only a game so who cares....and it is our 25$ so it's our right..and it ain't cheatin if you don't get caught...or it ain't cheatin if it's ineffective...or if Petro does it anyone can do it...also apparently two wrongs do make a right....down with the spirit of the rules....it's only a game and this means war....Bill Veeck lives!!!!! :wink:

[nevdully's]

Way too much misdirect in your last paragraph for me to address...Yeah that 3rd C is what destroys the newbies...really?...well that in not being able to play Hack in lf...and the waiver system...no it's that 3rd C.

[gkhd11a]

For one how exactly is HACK Wilson in LF going to be an advantage? I don't see that as a particularly brilliant move myself. I see the knowing of 2 catchers to be far more valuable exploitation of the rules than that

And it was you that said if something is wrong it is wrong, yet you use 2 catchers all the time don't you? Why don't you do the right thing and use 3 all the time or pick up a spare if your catcher goes down for 15? Because you know the rule will not be enforced and you take advantage of that as do most here that know the rule is not actually used. Otherwise when a +5 arm and 35 error catcher stood behind the plate for 12 games you'd lose 75% of those games. Which is why newbies will make that mistake

[Salty]

Let me see if I understand this correctly...Im slow so need lots of help.

If Hal lets me do something, its automatically okay?
Because there have been times when Hal didnt/couldn't enforce the 3 pure reliever rule just as one example- or the 2 Catcher rule for a second.

Also, to be honest, although Pets comment might be viewed as a negative response, I think the reply to it was much worse-
Im saying that because there were no personal shots taken in his comment- and there were a number of them which followed.

Okay, you can shoot me too now.