Hate to sound uninformed but I am.
Can anyone explain what a super reliever is? How does it(he) work into the strategy and what is the benefit to having one. Do they work better in certain situations and parks?
I do not pay much attention to the details of the game other than the obvious but maybe I should.
Super Reliever
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by Honyox R Us » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:15 am
[quote:113c0b467d="nevdully's"]I've used Pedro plenty in that role...love that card most, even more than Murray.[/quote:113c0b467d]
I second that, especially when your division is loaded w/RH hitting.
I second that, especially when your division is loaded w/RH hitting.
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by Valen » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:40 am
[quote:0d45615f46]I have tried and failed 3 times to get Murray since the card was added, twice I've got Rivera and once Sutter.[/quote:0d45615f46]
I think I could manage to suffer along with consolation prizes like that.
I am jealous. :lol:
I think I could manage to suffer along with consolation prizes like that.
I am jealous. :lol:
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by PotKettleBlack » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:50 am
[quote:c1a74ed267="misterpete"]Hate to sound uninformed but I am.
Can anyone explain what a super reliever is? How does it(he) work into the strategy and what is the benefit to having one. Do they work better in certain situations and parks?
I do not pay much attention to the details of the game other than the obvious but maybe I should.[/quote:c1a74ed267]
Super R is essentially a strategy to maximize the value of a reliever through using him in ways that would make Mike Marhsall's arm sore.
The goal is to get a stud reliever 200+ IP. The obvious candidates must be high quality pitchers who have at least an R3 rating (R4 is better, R5 is great if you can afford it or can live with Miljus).
Manipulate the settings of the relievers so that the other guys in the pen are pretty limited, and the Super R is available and set for Setup/Closer/Middle Man, with Slow Hook.
A certain member of the boards has recently thrown a hissy fit about another member choosing Dale Murray with the first pick in a draft because it is a clear indication that he intends to use Super R. The fit throwing member contends that Murray is priced for ~165 innings, so getting 250 IP out of him is cheating. That's kind of at the root of this thread.
Can anyone explain what a super reliever is? How does it(he) work into the strategy and what is the benefit to having one. Do they work better in certain situations and parks?
I do not pay much attention to the details of the game other than the obvious but maybe I should.[/quote:c1a74ed267]
Super R is essentially a strategy to maximize the value of a reliever through using him in ways that would make Mike Marhsall's arm sore.
The goal is to get a stud reliever 200+ IP. The obvious candidates must be high quality pitchers who have at least an R3 rating (R4 is better, R5 is great if you can afford it or can live with Miljus).
Manipulate the settings of the relievers so that the other guys in the pen are pretty limited, and the Super R is available and set for Setup/Closer/Middle Man, with Slow Hook.
A certain member of the boards has recently thrown a hissy fit about another member choosing Dale Murray with the first pick in a draft because it is a clear indication that he intends to use Super R. The fit throwing member contends that Murray is priced for ~165 innings, so getting 250 IP out of him is cheating. That's kind of at the root of this thread.
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by nevdully's » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:59 am
[b:e9af88b258]Motive[/b:e9af88b258]...I usually associate the word motive with "He had the motive to steal the money" or "What motive did he have to strangle his x-wife" ....Sorta has a bad or negative connotation to me (just me maybe)
[b:e9af88b258]Motivation[/b:e9af88b258]..."He had such strong motivation he was able to overcome his handicap"...I usually associate motivation with something positive (just maybe me)
When someone writes "[b:e9af88b258]manipulate[/b:e9af88b258]" it usually suggests something negative (to me)
Just my thoughts here. I found em interesting (maybe just me ;)
[b:e9af88b258]Motivation[/b:e9af88b258]..."He had such strong motivation he was able to overcome his handicap"...I usually associate motivation with something positive (just maybe me)
When someone writes "[b:e9af88b258]manipulate[/b:e9af88b258]" it usually suggests something negative (to me)
Just my thoughts here. I found em interesting (maybe just me ;)
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by Valen » Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:04 am
[quote:c7f07af20e]Can anyone explain what a super reliever is?[/quote:c7f07af20e]
Basically it is setting your team up in such a way that a reliever pitches excessive innings. For example Sutter who was just over 100 in real life getting used for 300+. So basically for the expense of 5.53 mil you are getting the workload/value of say a 10 mil Koufax. Of course Sutter is not the only pitcher used in this manner, just an example.
Some view this as cheating. Others do not. For some it is really an emotional hot button issue.
No question though if you can pull it off it gives you an advantage with regard to winning because you can shift that money saved somewhere else. So I cannot blame anyone for employing the strategy. One could argue it is just maximizing the value and performance of the cards you have.
Personally I think if you can pull it off congratulations are in order. If I were writing the computer code I would increase the fatigue of overused pitchers. But that is because I believe if a pitcher were really used in that manner their arms would show fatigue and performance would decline.
Basically it is setting your team up in such a way that a reliever pitches excessive innings. For example Sutter who was just over 100 in real life getting used for 300+. So basically for the expense of 5.53 mil you are getting the workload/value of say a 10 mil Koufax. Of course Sutter is not the only pitcher used in this manner, just an example.
Some view this as cheating. Others do not. For some it is really an emotional hot button issue.
No question though if you can pull it off it gives you an advantage with regard to winning because you can shift that money saved somewhere else. So I cannot blame anyone for employing the strategy. One could argue it is just maximizing the value and performance of the cards you have.
Personally I think if you can pull it off congratulations are in order. If I were writing the computer code I would increase the fatigue of overused pitchers. But that is because I believe if a pitcher were really used in that manner their arms would show fatigue and performance would decline.
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by Stormcrow2012 » Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:34 pm
Dick Radatz has a nice card, maybe not as nice as Dale Murray's card. But Radatz does not have ANY ballpark singles chances, and I believe Murray does. Also as someone else pointed out, Murray is not the best with the glove and Radatz is cheaper.
As with any strategy there are trade offs. The super reliever strategy is just one of many and like other posters mentioned it does not guarantee you will be successful. Murray's card is very expensive so if you do use him you will want to get a lot of innings out of him, which means you probably do not have very good starting pitching.
If you are not getting 200 innings (or more) out of Murray, you are overspending on his card, especially in the 80 million dollar leagues.
One last thought, I feel strongly that it is not cheating to use a super reliever. No where in OUR rules does this say this is cheating. Now many tournaments and other leagues have usage rules, but here at TSN we do not. And I am fine with that. As long as we all have to play by the same rules.....
As with any strategy there are trade offs. The super reliever strategy is just one of many and like other posters mentioned it does not guarantee you will be successful. Murray's card is very expensive so if you do use him you will want to get a lot of innings out of him, which means you probably do not have very good starting pitching.
If you are not getting 200 innings (or more) out of Murray, you are overspending on his card, especially in the 80 million dollar leagues.
One last thought, I feel strongly that it is not cheating to use a super reliever. No where in OUR rules does this say this is cheating. Now many tournaments and other leagues have usage rules, but here at TSN we do not. And I am fine with that. As long as we all have to play by the same rules.....
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by PotKettleBlack » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:01 pm
[quote:fd5360a248="Stormcrow2012"]Dick Radatz has a nice card, maybe not as nice as Dale Murray's card. But Radatz does not have ANY ballpark singles chances, and I believe Murray does. Also as someone else pointed out, Murray is not the best with the glove and Radatz is cheaper.[/quote:fd5360a248]
Radatz in ATGIV was nigh ungettable with the Eck card on offer. Since then, a lot of better closers have been added to the set and Radatz is easily had.
And nicely so, in the right park.
But before we say Radatz is better than Murray...
Radatz has BPHR (2L, 1R).
Radatz is +2 Hold, Murray -5.
Radtatz does not get lefties out as well as Murray. He has more XBH vs R (but gets more outs).
Radatz in ATGIV was nigh ungettable with the Eck card on offer. Since then, a lot of better closers have been added to the set and Radatz is easily had.
And nicely so, in the right park.
But before we say Radatz is better than Murray...
Radatz has BPHR (2L, 1R).
Radatz is +2 Hold, Murray -5.
Radtatz does not get lefties out as well as Murray. He has more XBH vs R (but gets more outs).
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by misterpete » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:05 pm
Thanks for the info.
Honestly[u:e23ace5574] if you can do it, I do not see it as an unethical practice. If the game permits it, so be it. I agree with the suggestion that SOM should change the fatigue rating on them if they feel it is misuse.
The closest I've come to this tactic is to draft a quality bullpen with one of these relievers in it and then use 2+m starters with a quick hook. It failed. Seems as though the cheap starters usually get wrecked in the first few innings and you play catch-up ball all season long.
I'm tempted to try it but, as you say, in 80m leagues, it's pretty difficult.
P[/u:e23ace5574]
Honestly[u:e23ace5574] if you can do it, I do not see it as an unethical practice. If the game permits it, so be it. I agree with the suggestion that SOM should change the fatigue rating on them if they feel it is misuse.
The closest I've come to this tactic is to draft a quality bullpen with one of these relievers in it and then use 2+m starters with a quick hook. It failed. Seems as though the cheap starters usually get wrecked in the first few innings and you play catch-up ball all season long.
I'm tempted to try it but, as you say, in 80m leagues, it's pretty difficult.
P[/u:e23ace5574]
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by misterpete » Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:07 pm
Sorry, didn't intend to underline. Bad hands :-) I'll never been confused with a quality shortstop or a surgeon! :-)
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