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- Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2012 11:27 pm
Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:33 pm
Anyone seen John's post?
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=638692
In fact, John stated the rules as they are written in the rulebook, but these are not the real rules that govern the relievers in closing situations.
Let me start with the part of the sentence that I set in bold. In fact, the game engine doesn't distinguish between closers with "no rating" and C0: the system acts as if all relievers have a C0 rating, and no reliever comes in the game automatically fatigued.
Consider these games:
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/ga ... 427257/551
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/ga ... 427257/512
Blevins clearly enters the game in a save mode (9th inning, 1-run lead), he has no closer rating, so he should entered the game as "fatigued", and yet he is NOT automatically fatigued (he finishes F9).
In fact, I've got many examples to show that the pitcher remains in full cylinders until he allows a hit or a walk. Another example, this one from Webb, who has no closer rating either.
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/426946/413
He got a full inning at F9 despite having no closer rating.
In this next example, however, because Webb allows a walk, his rating immediately falls back to F5
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/426946/373
(Notice that Duensing, who has no closer rating, relieves him, and gets the out, and finishes at F9)
What these examples show is that a reliever without a closer rating (or with a C0 rating) will not be recognized as fatigued (other than by regular rules) UNLESS he allows a hit or a walk (or expressed otherwise, the rating refers to the number of outs a reliever can go before BECOMING VULNERABLE TO being recognized as fatigued). Because their closer rating is 0, they are fatigued immediately after allowing something.
In contrast, a pitcher with, say, a C2 rating can expect to cash in at least 2 outs in the closer situation (as defined by SOM) before getting fatigued by allowing something. If the C2 closer gets two quick outs, his rating falls to 0, then he becomes immediately fatigued just like a C0 after allowing a hit or a walk. However, if the C2 closer starts the ninth inning in a closer situation and allows a hit or a walk to the first hitter, then he may get two outs while keeping his F9 rating until he allows something.
Two examples to illustrate what has just been written, with O'Day and Fields, both of whom have a closer rating of C2.
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/427257/512 (O'Day turns fatigued immediately after allowing a single, after he cashed in his two outs)
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/426946/762 (Fields remains fresh after allowing two singles and then registering his three outs (did not allow any single or walk after his two outs, hence he remained fresh).
Notice that Fields remained fresh after his second out (despite allowing two previous hits/walks). After his second out, his closer rating was down to zero, so he got into the vulnerability zone, but it was not enacted (he remained F9) because he didn't allow any hit or walk after that second out.
So here is how John's paragraph should be expressed:
The closer rating refers to the number of outs (in a closing situation) that a reliever can go before BECOMING VULNERABLE to being recognized as fatigued. FOR THIS VULNERABILITY TO BE ENACTED, THE RELIEVER MUST ALLOW A HIT OR A WALK in the situation. If a reliever is already in the game and it becomes a closer situation, his closer rating gets reduced by the number of outs he has already recorded. Pitchers with an N rating ARE EQUIVALENT TO CLOSERS WITH A C0 RATING: THEY are IMMEDIATELY fatigued in a "closer situation" AFTER ALLOWING A HIT OR A WALK.
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=638692
This closer rating is the number of outs a relief pitcher can go in a "closer situation" without being recognized as fatigued. However a Strat-O-Matic "closer situation" is not the same as a save situation. A "closer situation" is defined the pitching team having the lead in the 9th inning or later and the tying run on base or at bat.
Again, the rating refers to the number of outs a reliever can go before being recognized as fatigued. If a reliever is already in the game and it becomes a closer situation, his closer rating gets reduced by the number of outs he has already recorded. Pitchers with an N rating are automatically fatigued in a "closer situation".
Due to this if you're designated closer has a poor closer rating, he may enter the game already fatigued or fatigue very quickly after entering. Keep these rules in mind when selecting your closer. The last thing you want is a closer tiring in a big spot because he has a 0 closer rating!
In fact, John stated the rules as they are written in the rulebook, but these are not the real rules that govern the relievers in closing situations.
Let me start with the part of the sentence that I set in bold. In fact, the game engine doesn't distinguish between closers with "no rating" and C0: the system acts as if all relievers have a C0 rating, and no reliever comes in the game automatically fatigued.
Consider these games:
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/ga ... 427257/551
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/ga ... 427257/512
Blevins clearly enters the game in a save mode (9th inning, 1-run lead), he has no closer rating, so he should entered the game as "fatigued", and yet he is NOT automatically fatigued (he finishes F9).
In fact, I've got many examples to show that the pitcher remains in full cylinders until he allows a hit or a walk. Another example, this one from Webb, who has no closer rating either.
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/426946/413
He got a full inning at F9 despite having no closer rating.
In this next example, however, because Webb allows a walk, his rating immediately falls back to F5
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/426946/373
(Notice that Duensing, who has no closer rating, relieves him, and gets the out, and finishes at F9)
What these examples show is that a reliever without a closer rating (or with a C0 rating) will not be recognized as fatigued (other than by regular rules) UNLESS he allows a hit or a walk (or expressed otherwise, the rating refers to the number of outs a reliever can go before BECOMING VULNERABLE TO being recognized as fatigued). Because their closer rating is 0, they are fatigued immediately after allowing something.
In contrast, a pitcher with, say, a C2 rating can expect to cash in at least 2 outs in the closer situation (as defined by SOM) before getting fatigued by allowing something. If the C2 closer gets two quick outs, his rating falls to 0, then he becomes immediately fatigued just like a C0 after allowing a hit or a walk. However, if the C2 closer starts the ninth inning in a closer situation and allows a hit or a walk to the first hitter, then he may get two outs while keeping his F9 rating until he allows something.
Two examples to illustrate what has just been written, with O'Day and Fields, both of whom have a closer rating of C2.
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/427257/512 (O'Day turns fatigued immediately after allowing a single, after he cashed in his two outs)
http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/playbyplay/426946/762 (Fields remains fresh after allowing two singles and then registering his three outs (did not allow any single or walk after his two outs, hence he remained fresh).
Notice that Fields remained fresh after his second out (despite allowing two previous hits/walks). After his second out, his closer rating was down to zero, so he got into the vulnerability zone, but it was not enacted (he remained F9) because he didn't allow any hit or walk after that second out.
So here is how John's paragraph should be expressed:
The closer rating refers to the number of outs (in a closing situation) that a reliever can go before BECOMING VULNERABLE to being recognized as fatigued. FOR THIS VULNERABILITY TO BE ENACTED, THE RELIEVER MUST ALLOW A HIT OR A WALK in the situation. If a reliever is already in the game and it becomes a closer situation, his closer rating gets reduced by the number of outs he has already recorded. Pitchers with an N rating ARE EQUIVALENT TO CLOSERS WITH A C0 RATING: THEY are IMMEDIATELY fatigued in a "closer situation" AFTER ALLOWING A HIT OR A WALK.