New Bullpen Problems

I don't now what you guys are whining about. Super reliever has been a problem and the new bullpen roles are curbing the problem. The relievers are pitching less.

And whoever feels that the hitters are getting all of the advantages of the game are wrong. Hitters in Strat are often injured, but SP and relievers are unbelievably resistant to injuries.

The new bullpen rules (and reliever pricing in ATG9) are a welcomed change in my opinion.

I don't now what you guys are whining about. Super reliever has been a problem and the new bullpen roles are curbing the problem. The relievers are pitching less.

And whoever feels that the hitters are getting all of the advantages of the game are wrong. Hitters in Strat are often injured, but SP and relievers are unbelievably resistant to injuries.

The new bullpen rules (and reliever pricing in ATG9) are a welcomed change in my opinion.

You could start by reading my post, they you would understand I'm not complaining about the lack of super relievers. In fact, that problem hasn't even really been fixed with the new system. On my first team which has played 123 games so far, Giovanny Gallegos has 147 innings -- on pace for 193 innings.

I like that their idea is to make you build a better all around bullpen. Just give us the mechanism to make sure HAL selects the pitchers we want to pitch when they are available.

I don't now what you guys are whining about. Super reliever has been a problem and the new bullpen roles are curbing the problem. The relievers are pitching less.

And whoever feels that the hitters are getting all of the advantages of the game are wrong. Hitters in Strat are often injured, but SP and relievers are unbelievably resistant to injuries.

The new bullpen rules (and reliever pricing in ATG9) are a welcomed change in my opinion.

You could start by reading my post, they you would understand I'm not complaining about the lack of super relievers. In fact, that problem hasn't even really been fixed with the new system. On my first team which has played 123 games so far, Giovanny Gallegos has 147 innings -- on pace for 193 innings.

I like that their idea is to make you build a better all around bullpen. Just give us the mechanism to make sure HAL selects the pitchers we want to pitch when they are available.

Good example of the issue from last night, game 51.

Here are my bullpen and settings, ranked from high price to lowest .

Rogers (middle/setup), I assume he's unavailable, he threw 1.2 innings in game 50, prior to that hadn't pitched since 47.
Clippard (setup/tied late), I assume he's unavailable, he threw 2.1 innings in game 50, last pitched in game 48.
Stephenson (mopup/tied & 9th), last pitched game 49, 2.1 innings
Jansen (closer/tied & 9th), he's also set to don't bring in before 8th, so not an option here
Hill (mopup/behind & late), last pitched in game 48
Alvarez (lefty specialist), last pitched in game 43
Avilan (lefty specialist), last pitched in game 44

Down 4-1 in the 5th after my SP gives up a 3-run HR. Obviously this is a situation for the middle man, Rogers is unavailable and I don't have a second middle man set so there is no guidance there for who HAL should select.

Hill, Alvarez, and Avilan are definitely available. I also think Stephenson still available, although I'm not positive because I don't believe it's clearly stated when a RP is unavailable for 2 games versus 1 after an outing.

With those three, possibly four options, who does HAL select? My 500K lefty specialist. Avilan who is set at quick hook and avoid righties proceeds to pitch 3 innings, facing 11 straight right handed hitters, before giving way to Tim Hill who pitches the last inning in the loss.

Avilan actually pitched well giving up 0 runs on 2 hits and 2 walks while getting 2 double plays. I really don't understand the underlying logic in bullpen management anymore.

I really don't understand the underlying logic in bullpen management anymore.

That one sentence summed it up perfectly.

Possible solutions:

Spend more on starting pitching.
Focus more on SP endurance.
Use F settings to get more mileage out of your starters.
Spend more on relief.
Focus more on RP endurance (maybe five R1s are the problem).
Carry more than 11 pitchers.
Experiment with the role assignments:
a. Use all of the role assignments
b. Use none of the role assignments
c. Maximize your best relievers
d. Maximize your match-up relievers

Every set has its nuances. No reason to throw up your arms in frustration after only one complete season. There’s a lot to be learned here, and that means opportunity.

Well I think the basis of his argument is flawed.

No one said you have to use every role, with 2 pitchers assigned to each role.

Use roles for pitchers you want to limit, and use none for others to fill the gap.

Well I think the basis of his argument is flawed.

No one said you have to use every role, with 2 pitchers assigned to each role.

Use roles for pitchers you want to limit, and use none for others to fill the gap.

You think if HAL has the choice between 3 or 4 available RP's with no guidance, it should pick the cheapest option? Specifically putting that pitcher in a situation that his instructions are to avoid? I fail to see how my expectation that HAL select the best option available is flawed.

Second point is true and how I started the season, I was noticing a lot of inefficient decisions and tried to see if getting more aggressive about listing roles would make for better selection. In a small sample so far, it doesn't.

Agree on the third point, it's the direction I'll likely head going forward. But again, a major source of my complaint is the computer selecting the cheapest available RP in a manner against roles I do have defined.

Possible solutions:

Spend more on starting pitching.
Focus more on SP endurance.
Use F settings to get more mileage out of your starters.
Spend more on relief.
Focus more on RP endurance (maybe five R1s are the problem).
Carry more than 11 pitchers.
Experiment with the role assignments:
a. Use all of the role assignments
b. Use none of the role assignments
c. Maximize your best relievers
d. Maximize your match-up relievers

Every set has its nuances. No reason to throw up your arms in frustration after only one complete season. There’s a lot to be learned here, and that means opportunity.

I guess my post came off more frustrated than I actually am. I was really just pointing out what I see as a clear flaw in the bullpen logic and looking for any comments about what works for other people in bullpen roles.

I have two teams that are both doing quite well. I spent a lot more on relief pitching than I have historically, about 19%, and it seems to be working quite well. I just want to make sure I'm setting the preferences in the best manner.

The real effect of the new rules is tired pens--if a RP goes two innings or more--he has to be rested for two days---so two inning RPs have been hit hard with new rules, one less max inning per outing, and two days rest required---HAL constantly brings in the worst RP on the team in when the guy (or the two guys) in that role are unavailable, never the 3rd choice.

In effect the one day of rest for 2 days active has been nullified for the majority of games.

If a pitcher can only be assigned two roles OK. Two days rest OK, But make each role have 3 possible players instead of just two, because HAL seems incapable of bringing in the 3rd best RP in a situation.

I haven’t peeked behind the curtain, so take this FWIW...

Is it possible HAL is actually looking down the road to maximize higher leverage situations?

In real baseball, it makes somewhat logical sense that you proceed down the list of available pitchers from best to worst in most games. In Strat, knowing that there are usage rules in place, will HAL try to anticipate what’s to come ahead and attempt to maybe save certain pitchers for later in a game?

Again, I haven’t tried to study this in any real way, I’m just spit ballin’ here. It might explain why He would try and squeeze a bunch of innings from a suboptimal reliever.

For me personally, I’m leaning toward giving HAL the most margin of error with a LOT of reliever endurance available to Him.