Hot Stove

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fredpaii

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Re: Hot Stove

PostThu Dec 04, 2014 4:52 pm

fredpaii wrote:How is Headley's back? He always seemed to be injured when he was a Padre. He played through a lot of things such as bad shoulder, sore back (herniated disk), sore wrist, and a bad knee. It seemed to never end. I'm kind of glad he's no longer a Padre. He made me feel old(er)! ha


Just remembered the thumb injury.
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l.strether

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Re: Hot Stove

PostFri Dec 05, 2014 1:04 pm

Well, the Derek Jeter era is over, and the Didi Gregorius era has begun. It's not quite as sexy, but Gregorius decidedly improves the Yanks' defense at shortstop. If he hits .240 or higher and has an OBP of .325 or higher, it's still a step up.

The Yanks send Shane Greene--who looked good last year--to Detroit to become a back-of-the-rotation starter for them, and Detroit sends lhp Robbie Ray and inf prospect Domingo Leyba to Zona. The D-backs will hope Ray can bounce back from his horrid campaign last year and consider Leyba their 2b of the future. Ray was the center of the Fister trade last year, so all Detroit has to show for one of the best pitchers in baseball are Shane Greene and loogy Ian Krol...ouch.
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Ninersphan

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Re: Hot Stove

PostFri Dec 05, 2014 4:22 pm

And there is no truth to the rumor that Gregorious will have his rating changed to a 1 now that he's a Yankee. :-)
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LANCEBOUSLEY

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Re: Hot Stove

PostFri Dec 05, 2014 9:30 pm

Ray was the center of the Fister trade last year, so all Detroit has to show for one of the best pitchers in baseball are Shane Greene and loogy Ian Krol...ouch.

that's ok cause it's more than the mariners can show for trading the same guy!
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l.strether

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Re: Hot Stove

PostFri Dec 05, 2014 9:59 pm

That is true. But the Mariners (and everyone else) weren't quite sure what they had in the soft-tosser. Dombrowski knew full well he had a soft-tossing stud when he dealt him. Either way, Mike Rizzo comes out on top.
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teamnasty

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Re: Hot Stove

PostSat Dec 06, 2014 1:27 am

Gregorious is no star but AZ's return for him is unimpressive. Greene's pre-2014 history is pretty bad. I call this a moderate win for the Yanks here given the huge hole they had at SS. The Yanks' signing of Andrew Miller for 4/$36M is probably an overpay but a justifiable risk considering the thin market and the slim chance Miller could return some value as a starter again. Both moves pale in comparison to the Sox and Jays upgrades, and the Yanks look destined for 4th place this year.
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l.strether

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Re: Hot Stove

PostSat Dec 06, 2014 1:50 am

teamnasty wrote:Gregorious is no star but AZ's return for him is unimpressive. Greene's pre-2014 history is pretty bad. I call this a moderate win for the Yanks here given the huge hole they had at SS. The Yanks' signing of Andrew Miller for 4/$36M is probably an overpay but a justifiable risk considering the thin market and the slim chance Miller could return some value as a starter again. Both moves pale in comparison to the Sox and Jays upgrades, and the Yanks look destined for 4th place this year.

AZ got a solid return for Gregorius. They got a 23 year-old lhp who throws 95 and touches 97 who could relieve or fill the back end of the rotation, and a solid athletic infield prospect with a strong hit tool who hit .397 in A ball. I don't see them getting more for Gregorius, who hit .226/.290/.363 and whose footwork and defense declined this year. Also, Greene's pre-2014 history is unimportant, although he did have a 3.18 ERA in Trenton last year, so it wasn't that bad. More importantly, he now throws in the low-mid 90's, he had a 3.78 ERA, and more than 9 K/9ip. That's a pretty good get for the Tigers.

Miller's signing might be a slight overpay, but it's a good contract. The Yankees don't look like they want to meet Robertson's demands. That means Miller, a lefty who is tough on righties, could close until Betances is ready to take over, be a setup man when Betances is ready or if Robertson comes back. 36m is a little pricey, but Miller is both excellent and versatile. And there is no way he is going back to starting. He was a lousy starter, and he is an outstanding reliever.
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teamnasty

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Re: Hot Stove

PostSat Dec 06, 2014 2:09 am

Robbie Ray was awful last year. There is no reason to think that it's impossible for Miller to pull a CJ Wilson. Unlikely? Maybe, but not impossible. His effectiveness vs rhb augurs well for a return to the rotation at some point. Quality SS like Gregorious are much harder to find than talented but flawed relief pitchers like Robbie Ray. And man it bears repeating: Dombrowski got absolutely fleeced in last year's Fister trade
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l.strether

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Re: Hot Stove

PostSat Dec 06, 2014 3:09 am

Firstly, Leyba was the key part of the deal for the D-backs, not Ray. And while Ray was awful last year, he's still a 23-yr-old lhp who throws 95-97... a valuable commodity. Couple that with Leyba, an infield prospect with some speed, a solid hit tool, and who hit .397 in A ball last year, and you got a good deal. You overrate Gregorius and his value a bit. As I said earlier, he had an awful line of .226/.290/.363 last year and his defense significantly declined. His defensive runs saved were average (0), and his UZR was below average (-6.7). Shortstops with that unimpressive offensive and defensive package aren't too hard to find and aren't worth very much.

Also, we're not talking possible or impossible; we're talking probable or improbable. And it's highly improbable Miller starts for the Yanks. Miller was an awful starter for three different teams. it almost drove him out of baseball. Miller would not be a CJ Wilson, who--unlike Miller--didn't decidedly prove he couldn't start. Also, the Yankees didn't pay Miller 36M so he could go back to being a terrible (or even mediocre) starter. They're paying him that money to be the excellent reliever he has been the past three years, and possibly their closer.

We do agree, though, that Dombrowski got fleeced in the Fister trade. Dombrowski didn't have a very good year.
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teamnasty

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Re: Hot Stove

PostSat Dec 06, 2014 2:20 pm

Jeff Sullivan ranks the trade Yanks, Tigers, Az. Leyba is a meh prospect. We know Didi can handle the bigs.
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