Dead or Mostly Dead? a super reliever experiment

It's early yet. But right now Schupp is on pace for about 270 IP. So I'd say, at least in $100M leagues, the super reliever is not dead, just slightly tethered.

I would agree. Ferdie has pitched just 4 times in 12 games, but his IPs in those games have been 5.0, 3.2, 5.0, 6.2. I wonder if RP endurance should be limited to R3?

I am presently in five ATG 9 leagues. Dale Murray is not on a roster in two of them. The average salary cap of the three using Murray is 150 M. In the leagues where he has been selected his teams have played an average of 29 games. He has averaged 6 appearances per league and nine and 2/3rds innings pitched. In these three leagues he is on pace to average FIFTY FIVE innings pitched for the entire season. I have him in one of these leagues. He has appeared in two of the past twenty three games. I cant get him into games. I change my settings every few days to try and get him to pitch with no luck.

Strat changed relievers salaries upwards then drastically reduced their usage with the new bullpen logic.

Here is an example in every day terms: You were paying $1 a gallon for gas( Murray) and getting 20 M.P.G. ( 200 innings out of Murray ) now your paying $1.5 per gallon and getting 5 M.P.G. Makes perfect sense dont it.

I cant believe they made these changes.

3 games last night. No appearances by Murray.

As a few of you have noted, my experiment has some early results:

https://365.strat-o-matic.com/team/1578008


APPEARANCES
FS has 4 appearances in 12 games. On pace for 54 appearances in an 162 game season.

PREDICTABILITY/REST
FS has pitched in game one, and only game one, in each series. FS has required two straight nights off after each appearance, even when he only pitched 3.2 innings. That was particularly interesting to me--I had wondered (and still wonder, because we only have one data point) that when he pitched less than 5 innings (or maybe less than 4) that he would only need one night off. Let's keep an eye on that. Even if it turns out a (formerly) super-reliever needs two nights off most of the time, KNOWING that is moderately helpful as you manage your starting pitchers.

I have a sneaking suspicion that there are other lurking variables that I am too dumb to think of that might be contributing to HAL's choices about how long to rest FS.

INNINGS
FS has pitched 20.1 innings across 12 games. On pace for 271 and 1/3 innings.

VALUE
Subjective, of course. But if this is what I can get out of a former super-reliever, count me out. I'll figure out how to select some chaotic gaggle of R2 and R1 relievers to serve in what was formerly a rigidly designed bullpen. Will be a steep learning curve for me, but it will be fun.

EVALUATION OF STRAT's new bull pen
I give them props. While I'd like more clarity/control of my pen, the new status quo is better.

Response to OL
If he needs two nights off I don't think he needs a reduction in duration. If he turns out he can pitch more than 33% of the games, maybe. Or a price increase. But at 54 appearances, almost $10m is a damn high price (if you are using him out of the pen).

Maybe I missed it earlier. but what are your roles/settings for Murray?

Andy, here's what Chompsky says about settings:

Roles
Only two roles are set. Schupp has middle and mop-up. No one else has a role assigned.

I might be inclined to suggest removing the mop-up setting from Ferdie and substituting "Set-up". The risk with mop-up under ATG9 is that Ferdie is going to be pitching in a six-inning low-leverage outing with the game out of reach, then be on the shelf for two days.
Having a super-reliever pitch "mop-up" in ATG8 no doubt made sense, as a way to maximize innings. However, setup might be the better choice under the new rules. My guess that it might produced more—if shorter—outings, in higher-leverage situations. Ferdie might get to 270 IP either way, but they'd be more useful innings than if he's mopping up.

Still, if one can also get about 270 IP out of Ferdie simply by starting him every fifth day--would that be more valuable?

BTW, since is is a apropos, I thought I'd mention that I've been keeping an eye on this Roosky 100M Barnstormer team, to see what happening to relievers in ATG9. After the 81 game midpoint, Mellie Wolfgang—an RF5 (3.45M)—is leading all Barnstormer relievers in all leagues, as far as I can tell, with 122 IP. Wolfgang has 45 appearances, so he's averaging a little under 3 IP per outing. On two occasions he's pitched 4 outings in a row--in both cases under duress, when other RPs has been used up in an extra-inning game, and he entered as an F0.
https://365.strat-o-matic.com/team/1572145
Wolfgang is on a pace to pitch in 90 outings and get 244 IP. His record is: W/L 8-7. ERA is 4.83. S/BS is 5/5. In most other Barnstormer leagues, the top reliever in innings pitched is somewhere between 70 and 85 innings--and so on track for 140 IP to 170. Wolfgang is well ahead of the pace of all of these pitchers, I think largely because of his R5.

Interestingly, Wolfgang is not just devouring innings for a crummy assemblage of SPs. On this team, Kershaw, Schupp, and J. Fernandez headline a strong 5 man rotation. In this case Schupp, used as a starter, has 126 IP at the midpoint--four more than Wolfgang. Ferdie is on track to pitch 252 IP. Record is 7-3, ERA 3.56.

Wolfgang's settings on Roosky's team are "middle-man" & "setup." At least half the time, he's brought in w/o an explanation from HAL.

nice experiment. over 250 innings and 82 appearances just a guess. on another note i dont lime the 10 man pitcher on a roster. should have kept it at 9.

Maybe I missed it earlier. but what are your roles/settings for Murray?

Middle and mopup. I changed it to these yesterday.I have used many combinations trying to get him in games, always including middleman.

He has four appearances in past 29 games. Two of the four occurred last night.

Chompsky, interesting especially considering your past tendency in the matter at hand. I anyone could make it work, you would try your damned-est.

Many know I have been proselytizing about limiting the number of roles assigned under the new bullpen logic to give HAL better contextual decision space.

First ATG9 team here through just past the halfway point: https://365.strat-o-matic.com/team/1571956
Note the pen--only role set is Wade as mopup.
Then the four L/R specialists are set as avoids and quick hook. That's it.
Not a terrible result for a lower budget pen. So far, at least.

Lefty specialists faced 84% lefty.
Righty specialists faced 69% righty.

Pen is 10-5 with 15 saves and 6 blown. For less than 8M in a 100M league.
Wheeler not the same insane value he was, but can still be a good buy in certain cases.

I think it is really sad and silly that we know have much less control and we haven't even gotten rid of the super reliever. Which seems random to begin with. Why are we getting rid of the "Super Reliever" but not the super starter, cleanup hitter, or bum from the 1800s who is batting .440?