Unleashed vs Regular set, My annual rant

and Feliz could have been made an R3 only

By what logic should a guy who started 7 out of 8 games get R3 only? Would have made more sense to make him S5 only.
Actually since he averages 6 innings per start I think he should have been rated S6 only.

and Feliz could have been made an R3 only

By what logic should a guy who started 7 out of 8 games get R3 only? Would have made more sense to make him S5 only.
Actually since he averages 6 innings per start I think he should have been rated S6 only.

Not saying it's logiacl or that it should have happened, I'm just saying that in the past, we have seen guys with similar cards the were S/R that had the Start rating removed and became RP only, I'm guessing because it was felt they would unbalance game play as a starter. One could argue that it could have happened to Feliz this year.

Reposting this from the wish list forum cause only a few of you saw it there:

Yet again the unleashed set seems to have some very arbitary decisions.

How the heck is Ted Lilly left out but Neftali Feliz, Jeff Nieman both with less innings pitched, and to a lesser extent Matt Harvey, in the regular set??

You have the equalizer to really good cards with the pricing, just price them accordingly and leave them all in one set.

If this view was the majority, the majority of the leagues would use the unleashed set. You are, in effect, asking SOM to inflict your (minority) view on everyone. No thank you!

I'll buy that, I certianly don't want anyone forcing their views down my throuat either. but tell me why you are so opposed to the unleashed cards being included.


Please explain why Ted Lilly and Cory Luebke were held out but Neftali Feliz and Jeff Neiman are in??

Are Luebke and Feliz really gonna upset the balance of play?

My point is, if TSN (cause they started this practice) hadn't begun to start keeping certian cards out, there wouldn't be controversey nor any need for two seperate sets.

I just haven't heard a cogent arguement for not putting them in.

"It's not realalistc if FILL IN THE BLANK leads the league in FILL IN THE BLANK stat."

Who cares?

There's nothing realistic about this game as it's played anyway.

We don't adhere to usage limits, RP routinely pitch WAY more innings than what's on their card.

Starting pitchers haven't pitched on 3 days rest in the majors since the Seventies, yet it's still in this game.

We platoon guys all the time that would never sit in the Majors, Ethier and Choo come immediatly to mind.

Most of the games are played with 12 team leagues with most teams having 4-5 all star caliber players on them, that's realistic?

So what difference does it make if a guys has a great card one year, and will lead a statiscal category that he wouldn't do in real life?

I just don't know how you draw that line in the sand and say that including these guys upsets the balance of play or isn't realistic given all the other unrealistic things that happen in the game.

You want realism, go buy the CD-rom and sim the MLB season.

Me, I want every possible player I can get my hands on to help me win against the other 11 guys I'm competing with.

they are limiting the set here...

but hey let's include E Aybar and Kelly Jonhson in ATG!

The argument for having an unleashed set I think is pretty simple really. They are trying to prevent some guy who barely played to be the MVP or Cy Young of a league. I know there are players that maybe only had 200 AB that could be the best in the league (Moss maybe) but at least they had a couple hundred ABs.

There are more people than you probably realize that play this game and expect the stats to closely mirror what happened in real life rather than play this as a fantasy game and the names on the cards really don't matter like most of us do. If given their wishes they would limt all hitters and pitchers to their real life AB or IP. If there was such a usage limit the prices of the cards would be vastly different for the guys that didn't play very much.

The argument for having an unleashed set I think is pretty simple really. They are trying to prevent some guy who barely played to be the MVP or Cy Young of a league. I know there are players that maybe only had 200 AB that could be the best in the league (Moss maybe) but at least they had a couple hundred ABs.

There are more people than you probably realize that play this game and expect the stats to closely mirror what happened in real life rather than play this as a fantasy game and the names on the cards really don't matter like most of us do. If given their wishes they would limt all hitters and pitchers to their real life AB or IP. If there was such a usage limit the prices of the cards would be vastly different for the guys that didn't play very much.

Their argument is nothing more than needing to exclude a certain number of players, end of story.

What about Josh Johnson last year? one more game started than Lilly, but he gets in the game?

Again, look at De Aza last season, more ab's than Lawrie but Lawrie gets in the game, De Aza doesn't?

No one is complaining that Parmelee isn't in. It's the guys who have enough of a body of work, and aren't the guys who will be winning the awards we can't understand.

Is Lilly's card decent, yes. Is it a top 5 pitcher, no. He's had a card every season the game has been around online. Some better than others. He has enough body of work not to sit him. More than Johnson last year ever has. But Johnson (all of one game more started) is a multi Cy Young winner in the game and the TOP non * SP. Not even the same.

Again, if there was a rhyme or reason on to why they were excluded, no one would complain. The "pick 14 names off this list out of a hat and they sit in unleashed" is what drives us all crazy.

The argument for having an unleashed set I think is pretty simple really. They are trying to prevent some guy who barely played to be the MVP or Cy Young of a league. I know there are players that maybe only had 200 AB that could be the best in the league (Moss maybe) but at least they had a couple hundred ABs.

There are more people than you probably realize that play this game and expect the stats to closely mirror what happened in real life rather than play this as a fantasy game and the names on the cards really don't matter like most of us do. If given their wishes they would limt all hitters and pitchers to their real life AB or IP. If there was such a usage limit the prices of the cards would be vastly different for the guys that didn't play very much.

Their argument is nothing more than needing to exclude a certain number of players, end of story.

What about Josh Johnson last year? one more game started than Lilly, but he gets in the game?

Again, look at De Aza last season, more ab's than Lawrie but Lawrie gets in the game, De Aza doesn't?

No one is complaining that Parmelee isn't in. It's the guys who have enough of a body of work, and aren't the guys who will be winning the awards we can't understand.

Is Lilly's card decent, yes. Is it a top 5 pitcher, no. He's had a card every season the game has been around online. Some better than others. He has enough body of work not to sit him. More than Johnson last year ever has. But Johnson (all of one game more started) is a multi Cy Young winner in the game and the TOP non * SP. Not even the same.

Again, if there was a rhyme or reason on to why they were excluded, no one would complain. The "pick 14 names off this list out of a hat and they sit in unleashed" is what drives us all crazy .

Preach it geekor!!!

I haven't even mentioned the 2 catchers yet, look at Snyder or Luna and tell me how those cards are gonna wind up on any MVP lists or lead the league in hitting. Ecven if they were included in the regular set I doubt they'd be drafted much.

The argument for having an unleashed set I think is pretty simple really. They are trying to prevent some guy who barely played to be the MVP or Cy Young of a league. I know there are players that maybe only had 200 AB that could be the best in the league (Moss maybe) but at least they had a couple hundred ABs.

There are more people than you probably realize that play this game and expect the stats to closely mirror what happened in real life rather than play this as a fantasy game and the names on the cards really don't matter like most of us do. If given their wishes they would limt all hitters and pitchers to their real life AB or IP. If there was such a usage limit the prices of the cards would be vastly different for the guys that didn't play very much.

And my counter to that is, What difference does it make? why does it matter? Which I pointed out in my post above. With all the other inconsistancies from real life in the game, why draw an arbitrary line in the sand over those two statistics.

And, if that is the resson, please tell me which one of the 14 players on that list will do either of those things. I see 2 and 1 of those is borderline; Kozma and Falu.
Moss will do that, but they didn't cut him and nobody has yet complained he's in the game.

If people are expecting the cards to play like the actual stats way the game is set up here, they are deluding themselves. They ONLY way that happens is if you sim a season, becuase that's what the cards were designed to do, recreate the past season using the exact matchups and limits. Using the cards the way we do, with smaller leageus and near all-star lineups, it just ain't gonna happen. That dog don't hunt, as one of my college professors was so fond of saying.

But as geekor more or less pointed out, Strat certianly couldn't justify having an unleashed set with just 2 guys in oi, so they added these other boderline cases and called it a set.

If they'd just put 'em all in no muss no fuss no controversy.

How much more whining on this topic will there be? I bet another 2 pages before the last whimper of not being able to see a Ted Lilly card in the regular game set for another year. Good Lord, I bet Lilly himself doesn't care this much...if he did, he would just play the unleashed set.

Controversy? Hardly.

How much more whining on this topic will there be? I bet another 2 pages before the last whimper of not being able to see a Ted Lilly card in the regular game set for another year. Good Lord, I bet Lilly himself doesn't care this much...if he did, he would just play the unleashed set.

Controversy? Hardly.

It's not about Lilly, he's just the latest example, it's about getting rid of the unleashed set and just having one set.

If it bothers you you do not have to read it.

and I do play unleashed, where I'm able.