Satchel Paige thrown out stealing for 3rd out, no H&R/SH

Satchel Paige thrown out stealing, for 3rd out in 5th inning -- batter, Gonzalez, set to "do not H&R or bunt"

pitcher and catcher were both +1 and stealing WAS, I admit, set to aggressive ... but STILL!

http://onlinegames.strat-o-matic.com/game/427215/121

absent a failed H&R or bunt, pitchers shouldn't be trying to steal unless "very aggressive" and a +5 in Pitcher/Catcher ratings AND less than 2 outs

exception -- pitcher's the trailing guy on an inadvertent double-steal when the guy ahead of him steals, I can see that

Some pitchers have steal ratings. I don't think the data is available.

This definitely fall under the category of if a rating is used it should be revealed.

Not only should these ratings be revealed so we can know these pitchers might steal. But also so we could target such pitchers if we were running some kind of theme team where they would be desirable. For example if one were trying to set the team steals record.

Probably should float this game by online support and see if you can get a response.

In two different leagues I've seen Ray Caldwell (1920) steal 10 bases. In one league he was 10-2, in the other 10-1. In the first league, he stole 4 bases in a single game.

It seems to me Caldwell has to have some kind of steal rating. It may be a bug that SOM doesn't even know about. In real life, Caldwell's steal record in 1920 was 0-2.

In my current 80M league (where Caldwell's SB record is 10-1 after 108 games) eight different pitchers have attemped steals. Overall, these pitcher base-thiefs have been quite successful, with a combined SB record of 23-4. That's a steal percentage of .851, much better than the league average of .708.

I'm not sure what gives, but this definitely seems a bit glitchy.

This is odd - I checked the '48 roster sheet and Paige is not listed as having a steal rating. I also checked the Negro League roster sheet and, again, he is not listed as having a steal rating. BTW - you can check out supplemental running/stealing rating for pitchers on the Strat-O-Matic Game Site. Click on Connect, go to Strat-O-Museum then Roster Sheet Archive. All the season are listed by year.

-The Sheik

Thanks, Mr. Yerboudi.

Thanks, Mr. Yerboudi.

Yes, thanks! I never knew about these roster sheets. And they explain Ray Caldwell's success as a base stealer. Caldwell's "supplementary steal rating" on the 1920 season roster is "E 2-12 - 20 - 6". My guess is that while Caldwell is rated an E stealer, SOM is giving him a 2 - 12 chance of getting a good jump (essentially he always gets a good jump) and he has a 20 steal rating when he does get that good jump.

Am I reading this right? If so, Caldwell has a better base steal rating than Rickey Henderson's best card. Which one is Rickey's best could be argued, but I'd say its: *2-9/- (18-16).

Caldwell's rating is based on an 0-2 actual steal record. This doesn't make much sense to me—and it may mean that SOM accidentally entered bad info onto Caldwell's card. I see some other pitchers who have 20-6 ratings but who only get a good jump on a 3 or 4. Then there's a pitcher who is E 2-12 but with only a 3 good jump rating. So maybe Caldwell's numbers got switched around. An E 2-12 - 3 -1 would make more sense based on Ray's actual performance.

However, the current rating does explain his amazing SB performance, and I now know why certain pitchers do actually steal occasionally.

This is odd - I checked the '48 roster sheet and Paige is not listed as having a steal rating. I also checked the Negro League roster sheet and, again, he is not listed as having a steal rating. BTW - you can check out supplemental running/stealing rating for pitchers on the Strat-O-Matic Game Site. Click on Connect, go to Strat-O-Museum then Roster Sheet Archive. All the season are listed by year.

-The Sheik

Found a Paige listing in the 75th HOF roster sheet 1-10 C *2-6/9,10 (15-6). Might be the one used.