an experiment you can try at home...

use ATG8 to draft a team to the limit of the cap - make sure you use high-end players
change the player set to ATG9 - likely you will not be able to do so because the change will put you over the cap


in case you are not convinced that the handful of players in the $2-8M that got their prices reduced are NOT compensation for the overall increases in pitchers

Good experiment. I'll have to try that.

Confirmation bias can screw with our sense of reality. Confirmation bias certainly messes with what is left of my own degraded sense of reality all the time. Math is a nice antidote, thankfully. Here are just a few players whose price has been reduced.


Catcher
Piazza 993-->961
Hartnet 818-->778
Lopez 782-->703
Hoiles
Padget
Munson
Myatt
Ferguson
Nokes

1B
Sisler 1027 -->1005
Terry several cards
Beckwith!!
Derek Lee
Brouthers!
Anson 472-->435
the Cat 329-->321
Rod Carew 295 -->259
Ken "Walkman" Smith 209-->204
Blowers 256-->164
Todt 64-->51


2B
Barnes 1144-->1107
3 of 4 Hornsby cards
1 of the Morgan cards
Boone's high end card
Some of Sandberg
Some of Gordon & Grich & White & Lopes
Pedroia


the list(s) go on and on and on.

3B
A-Roid 1033-->1026
Beckwith (As mentioned under 1B) 981-->963
Rolen 956-->941
A-Roid (oh please leave my Mets alone!) 953-->898
Bogman 960-->902
Joey Bats 905-->858
Several Mathews cards
McGraw!!!! 791--> 773
Thome, Santo, Torre, Beltre
Many more below the $8m mark


SS
Larkin 1062 to 1049
Wells 1003 to 953
Appling! 762 to 755
Lloyd 749 to 682 (if it gets another $2m reduction it might be playable)
Rollins and the Wizard and Petrol! and just-retired Reyes
The cheap Vaughan. Stephen Drew
A bunch of Fernandes cards.
Of course Crosetti, and my favorite Ozwaldo!

LF
Gonzo
Mr. Frank Robinson 945 to 908
Cheap Musial card
Several of the "say hey" cards
Simmons 885 to 851
Delahanty 879 to 844
Ricky! 780 to 768, and 696 to 688, and 537 to 510
Walker! 702 to 636
Garr!Garr!Garr! 380 to 378
Don't even start with Weintraub, Brouhard, Collins, Holland, Piniella or Tommy Davis (164 to 129).

CF
Cobb 1126 to 1068
Several "say hey" cards
A bunch of "the Kid"'s cards
The Mr. Robinson from the song, 946 to 886
Resier 856 to 777
HIll 692 to 635
Kemp
'Cutch
Brown

RF
Gwynn 844 to 811
Keeler
Mr. October
Wanter
Suziki
VG 953 to 813
Heilman 1036 to 1004
Frank Robinson 945 to 908
3 Hammer cards
1 Joey Bats card


and
on
and
on
and
on
and
on
and
on
and
on

Perhaps I shouldn't say this, but one recent ATG9 Barnstormer team (80M) played for 5.75M less overall than it would have cost in ATG8. That's a pretty significant 7% discount.

The bargains are there, if you look for them.

redefining the experiment is always a nice trick - a few nuggets sprinkled in the middle is little, if any compensation for the broad price increases at the top and the bottom - making Ruth, or for that matter Bonds, unaffordable is not much of an improvement to the game, my opinion

I didn't mean to be (too) rhetorical. Maybe there is something to what you are saying, Patrick.

When I play $80m, rostering Bonds or Ruth will take an inordinate amount of your cap. I see that.

At $80, which is pretty much all I play, I'm trying to find new options. They are there, I think. That said, some of my old favorites are much pricier now.

My favorite pitching setup in ATG-8 was 5 starting pitchers who each cost between $2.55 and $2.36. One $5-$6m reliever, one $3m reliever, and one reliever at $1m. The total was always just south of $23m for all of my pitching needs. Leaving a bit over $57m for hitters. That favorite package of pitchers that used to cost me $23m in ATG-8, now would cost me over $30m in ATG-9. Blech.

So you are right. But while you are right, it is also the case (I think) that there are new favorites for us to find @ $80m. And if we want some of the old favorites, well, maybe we have to play $100m. I don't know anything for sure. Just musing.

Chompsky, sir, not saying I have not found some guys, and Pinson, one of my favorites, is cheaper, and some SPs I like to use are cheaper, and don't get me wrong, I totally support the price increases for the high=-end relievers, even though they dragged my entire usual pen along with them... but almost every guy I relied on for the middle of my order is more expensive actually the low-end guys are more expensive too, Moseby and W. Davis in cf used to be worth it.

But I will be honest, it was Chief Wilson and Claudell (Washington) that really irritated me... they used to be little snipers at the bottom of the lineup when I was able to negotiate a deal with Barry or the Babe's agents and with them having received the same COLA as the big boys, teams I enjoyed building just don't work anymore.


Since no one wants to play 8, anymore, I guess this is what we get. I don't think I need to like or endorse it.

Maybe if the salary negotiations (that is, repricing strategy/parameters) had been more transparent (it could happen - SOM could slide back the curtain, I don't think it will happen, but it could.) I would be less agitated by the changes.


bottom line, virtually every time I try to convert a team from 8 to 9, I am unable because the change makes the salary total over the cap. the only times I did not experience that, I had squirreled away a few million for the draft.


I did the experiments. calling out list of guys in isolation is not the same as converting a team. Changing the experiment does not invalidate the reported observation.


It is not just about the game puzzle of piecing together the team, part of the fun of the season is seeing names of guys (whose careers) you liked in your stats and boxscores and headlines, getting guys we like was, I always thought, part of the new card discussion process.