Segregation-adjusted WAR leaderboard

True. Schilling didn't fail the "eye test".
It was the "ear test" that tripped him up.

A player's mouth spouting personal opinions about politics, or just plain old just being unpleasant, shouldn't keep them out of the HOF. If that were so Ty Cobb wouldn't be in. Have you seen that movie? I love baseball but I couldn't stomach that movie about Cobb. If it is really accurate then he must be the all-time most angry/arrogant (and many more negative adjectives here) baseball player ever.

The Cobb movie was based on a lot of falsehoods, Hollywood sensationalism. Wrong on so many accounts about Cobb. The author Charles Leerhsen broke new research ground and wrote a game-changing biography of Cobb several years ago, "Ty Cobb: A Terrible Beauty."

https://imprimis.hillsdale.edu/who-was- ... ats-wrong/

For example, Leehsen writes: "It is 'common knowledge' that Cobb was 'an avowed racist'—but when and where did he make such a vow and where is it recorded? A 1984 biography of Cobb, written by a college professor named Charles Alexander, is typical. It describes three people who fought with Cobb—a night watchman, a bellhop, and a butcher—as being black. Such evidence was enough for documentary filmmaker Ken Burns, whose made-for-PBS series Baseball described Cobb as an embarrassment to the game because of his racism and cast Cobb as the anti-Jackie Robinson.

But Burns, like so many others, was letting himself be misled by the oft-repeated myth. Looking into census reports, birth certificates, and contemporary newspaper accounts, I found that all three of the black fighters cited by Charles Alexander were in fact white."

And, in fact, Ty Cobb was descended from a long line of abolitionists. "His great-grandfather was a minister who preached against slavery and was run out of town for it. His grandfather refused to fight in the Confederate army because of the slavery issue. And his father was an educator and state senator who spoke up for his black constituents and is known to have once broken up a lynch mob," Leerhsen wrote.

Yeah Cobb apparently supported integration and the whole mythos stems from an early biographer with some kind of ax to grind.

As far as Schilling, it's hard for me to get worked up one way or the other. Players who are religious conservatives get inducted all the time, so it's obviously not JUST politics. The idea that there's some line between politics and hate/fascism has some merit; dude is openly supporting avowed white supremacists like Paul Nehlen. The HOF throws a parade for living inductees every year, do we really want to be a society that throws a parade every year for Curt Schilling? Idk. Tough for me to have much sympathy. Besides, the HOF is so far beyond redemption at this point that for me its value lies in getting to witness its voters insistently stomping on their own dicks every election season. But votes on Schilling never fit into the category because there was never a clearly correct position to take. I'm just glad he's no longer on the ballot.

in my humble opinion, the hall of fame should be solely about whether a player was either a dominant player at their position for multiple years or had a long career of solid play including multiple AS/GG selections and/or finishes in the top 5 for MVP or CY Young awards. Hard to judge players across different eras, but we should be able to recognize those who excelled in their own era.

For the personal stuff, well Cooperstown doesn't have a wing for Noble Peace Prize receipients, so awards or penalty's for personal beliefs should be decided in other venues. The baseball hall should be about baseball play. Just my opinion though.

Well, this certainly took a turn.

Besides, the HOF is so far beyond redemption at this point ...

I actually place more credence in the MaxPower HOF than the Cooperstown HOF. At least there is consistent logic to determine who is in and who is out.

By the way, I liked the baseball card images on the MAX500. Better than bronze busts.

Who knows the truth about Cobb, but certainly as a ballplayer he meets the eye, ear, touch, smell etc tests.

But gosh we go from Cobb to fascism...Although we may want to take pause and note that all fascists started as socialists and as the most progressive ideologues of their time, with the common thread requiring unyielding submission to the state for their greater evil designs. Whether it was Giovanni Gentile to Mussolini or the Strassers to Hitler. If we think Cobb was terrible, and maybe he was, he didn't appoint a klansman to the SCOTUS nor reinstitute workplace segregation in the federal workforce--and those individuals have monuments and bridges and coinage.
There is plenty of hate to go around yesterday, today, and tomorrow. All of it should be called out and discarded.

Back to baseball, I also am not worked up over Schilling, but mostly because his numbers didn't make him a lock for the hall. Yes there are many borderliners in already, but putting Schilling in doesn't fix that. Hell I'd rather see Rose in before Schilling. Also not a very likeable guy but he is pete freaking rose.

I guess for me the HOF is by definition a popularity contest. The players know that going in--it is a vote. If they don't want to toe the line to appease the voters, then maybe they don't get in. That seems like a choice. Schilling didn't set aside his personal pieces that were not likeable to the voters. There is no absolute arbiter--it is a vote. Rose tried to be contrite after he realized it was a vote, but by then it was too late.

Why does someone like Jeter get in easily? C'mon...the baseball performance unlocks the door. The personality allows walking across the threshold.

I agree Max's work here illustrates a truer objective look. Unfortunately the HOF will never be objective because people are involved. So in that way the work here is valuable to anyone who appreciates the purity of the game and of the struggle to compete.
Because to the true player, sport can be the greatest of equalizers, the purging of prejudices, and the ultimate test of character.
Best

Hack--that was interesting. I didn't know much about Cobb but that was intriguing stuff.

I know more about Hack Wilson now though from a book I read recently...

Well, this certainly took a turn.

Besides, the HOF is so far beyond redemption at this point ...

I actually place more credence in the MaxPower HOF than the Cooperstown HOF. At least there is consistent logic to determine who is in and who is out.

By the way, I liked the baseball card images on the MAX500. Better than bronze busts.

Thanks for the kind words lab

I recently went through this list to get ideas for new card nominations. For hitters I looked at OPS+, for pitchers I looked at ERA+. I also looked at waaWL% for both (basically WAR as a rate stat). I refuse to get the card viewer app as the subscription/recurring payment scheme is absurd and anti-consumer. So all these numbers are based purely on Baseball Reference and any help anyone cares to offer about why other seasons are better than the one I've listed in terms of the actual card is more than welcome.

First number is the player's HOF+ score, essentially their distance from the HOF borderline in my rating scheme. 100 is the borderline. Second number is OPS+ or ERA+, or in the case of possible improvements, the difference between that figure and the player's best currently carded season.

GREAT CAREERS, NO CARD
104 162 1885 Charlie Bennett
101 177 1879 Paul Hines
94 135 1999 Brad Radke
92 201 1886 Bob Caruthers
90 163 1890 Tony Mullane
88 154 1888 Charlie Buffinton
88 166 1888 Harry Stovey
84 156 1881 Fred Dunlap
84 142 1882 Joe Start
84 173 1886 Hardy Richardson
84 185 1880 George Gore

GREAT SEASONS, NO CARD
69 186 1889 Jack Stivetts
63 180 1879 Charley Jones
55 175 2021 Juan Soto
54 202 1885 Dave Orr
54 168 1876 Jim Devlin
50 175 1885 Henry Larkin
49 196 2018 Trevor Bauer
46 179 2019 Hyun Jin Ryu
43 203 1875 Lip Pike

PROBABLE UPGRADES
176 39 1885 Roger Connor
130 29 1901 Bobby Wallace
125 22 1875 Deacon White
123 33 1980 Buddy Bell
118 49 1884 Jim O'Rourke
114 21 1959 Larry Jackson
109 48 1885 Buck Ewing
108 30 1939 Ted Lyons
102 25 1890 Jake Beckley
101 25 1894 Amos Rusie
100 46 2015 Nelson Cruz
99 61 1898 Clark Griffith
97 31 1991/93 Devon White
95 25 2002 Bartolo Colon
95 36 2018 Chris Sale
93 28 1876 Ross Barnes
91 58 1878-79 John Ward
90 25 1886 Bid McPhee
90 27 2016 Jon Lester
87 26 1963 Curt Simmons
82 20 1952 Luke Easter
82 28 1950 Ned Garver
82 38 1965 Jim Maloney
70 85 1923 Dolf Luque

POSSIBLE UPGRADES
220 16 1881 Cap Anson
194 14 1967 Al Kaline
174 19 1992 Mike Mussina
173 12 1953 Robin Roberts
129 15 2008 CC Sabathia
128 15 1886 Jack Glasscock
123 15 2014 Cole Hamels
121 15 2018/22 Manny Machado
118 10 1893 Billy Hamilton
114 14 1937 Gabby Hartnett
114 12 2001 Jason Giambi
113 11 1963 Vada Pinson
111 19 2014 Russell Martin
110 18 1995 David Wells
109 13 1963 Jim Gilliam
104 16 1981 Chet Lemon
103 18 1977 Frank Tanana
101 18 1901 Jesse Burkett
101 15 1930 Wes Ferrell
100 12 1999 Jamie Moyer

This list is mostly for my own edification but feel free to chime in with any and all commentary, and definitely feel free to use it for your own nominations.