pitcher fatigue

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jlt53

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pitcher fatigue

PostTue Sep 18, 2012 11:42 pm

So I have never understood how pitcher fatigue works. Anyone who does, please answer this.
Dale Murray pitched 5 innings against me in game 5 of the finals and finished at F9. He p itched 3.2 innings in Game. 6 and got hit a bit and finished at F0. What is his status for Game 7?
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Valen

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostThu Sep 20, 2012 12:45 am

You got me on this one. What makes a pitcher drop in F rating and by how much is a mystery to me as well.

One thing that would be nice is between series or playoff games show the F ratings that would be in effect for each pitcher if they pitched in the next game. Then we might see for example that Murray would be entering at say F3 and change out setup men for that series/game. Even better if we could schedule the settings to change back after the first game.
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jlt53

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostThu Sep 20, 2012 1:56 pm

I'm glad other people don't understand it either.
For the record, I got ahead in Game 7 and held on for the win and Dale never got in the game against me.
I have nothing against the super-reliever idea -- and use it myself on occasion -- but having a guy pitch 5 innings one day and come back with 3.2 the next strikes me as pretty over the top. He ended up throwing almost 140 pitches in two days. I know Iron Man McGinnity might be able to do it, but Dale Murray????
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Valen

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostFri Sep 21, 2012 11:47 am

Strato will never admit to making a rating mistake. But in my opinion on the Murray card and many others like him is he does not deserve the R4 rating. No way he regularly went 4 innings that year while only pitching 69 innings.

Another flaw in the game rules relates to how frequently a pitcher can pitch. Real teams may run a guy out there 3 or 4 games in a row if that pitcher is only facing a couple hitters or an inning at a time. But for pitchers that pitch 3 or more innings they almost always give that pitcher multiple days rest between appearances. The Strato rules allow a guy to go 3+ innings multiple games in a row.

Before anyone goes off please note there is a saying the rules are flawed does not necessarily say anyone is wrong who capitalizes on those flawed rules.

This is an example of where Strato could learn from these online gamers to improve their product. Seeing the existing rules result in completely unrealistic and impossible usage they could choose to adjust the rules accordingly.
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Valen

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostFri Sep 21, 2012 12:26 pm

One would hope long term this would be an improvement we see with Strato running the show instead of TSN.
In the past we had to convince TSN there was an issue and then they had to convince Strato of the same before anything was changed.

Perhaps with Strato running things directly if they perceive the super reliever as an unrealistic strategy they will act to make the impact upon entering F rating lower in games following a high inning outing by a reliever.
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dukie98

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostFri Sep 21, 2012 1:24 pm

Valen wrote:Strato will never admit to making a rating mistake. But in my opinion on the Murray card and many others like him is he does not deserve the R4 rating. No way he regularly went 4 innings that year while only pitching 69 innings.


For Murray, the inning count is skewed because he didn't come up until early July (which creates a different set of problems). He averaged more than 2 innings per outing (32 games), and he went at least 4 innings 3 times, and at least 3 innings eight other times. (Notably, on September 22, he pitched 2 innings in the first game of a doubleheader, and 4 more in the nightcap).

The issue for me is not whether he's a R4 as compared to R3 -- it's that he's included in the ATG set in the first place, based off of a fluky half-season that is completely out of line with the rest of his career. There's no good reason why the most dominant reliever in the card set -- and probably the most commonly used -- is based on a fluke card. The problem is compounded when the super-reliever strategy is factored in, such that he regularly pitches more innings than any reliever in MLB history has ever pitched. As Murray appears to be used in nearly all leagues, even at $100M caps, that suggests that his card is significantly underpriced. At the very least, if SOM doesn't replace it outright, I'd like to see a significant price increase.
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Valen

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostSun Sep 23, 2012 8:19 pm

The problem is compounded when the super-reliever strategy is factored in, such that he regularly pitches more innings than any reliever in MLB history has ever pitched

To me that means either he should not be R4 or the rules for how quickly a pitcher can throw again without fatigue following a 3 or 4 inning outing needs to be changed. In Strat no matter how many innings a reliever throws he can come right back in next game and do it again.

Bottom line the rating combined with the rules results in impossible results. Thus Strato should either adjust the rating or the rules if not both.

In the meantime I cannot blame anyone for using the strategy as it gives you value equal to most top starters for the price of a reliever. The problem with pricing him like a 300 inning starter is he is then made unusable as a reliever by those not using the super reliever strategy.
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Valen

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Re: pitcher fatigue

PostMon Sep 24, 2012 11:14 am

There's no good reason why the most dominant reliever in the card set -- and probably the most commonly used -- is based on a fluke card

For the record I agree with this 100% the fact it is used so much at every cap level and always so high on the draft card to get him speaks to how underpriced the card is.

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