Who are next years 1s

[STEVEPONEDAL]

may be more realistic then '07. Although in that set were the middle infielders more traditionally glove men?

[AeroDave10]

Here are some more 2007 Range Factor comparisons (with approximately at least 75 starts at the position):

[b:a1b3716189][u:a1b3716189]2B[/u:a1b3716189][/b:a1b3716189]
Brandon Phillips (1e8) 5.08
Orlando Hudson (1e12) 4.91

Ian Kinsler (3e21) 5.69
Mark Ellis (2e5) 5.45
Kaz Matsui (2e6) 5.33
Adam Kennedy (3e16) 5.24
Robinson Cano (3e13) 5.22
Tadahito Iguchi (3e8) 5.15
Jose Lopez (4e10) 5.14
Aaron Hill (2e14) 5.13
Chase Utley (3e12) 5.10
Placido Polanco (2e0) 5.08
Marcus Giles (3e11) 5.08
Josh Barfield (3e21) 5.06
Ronnie Belliard (3e8) 5.04
Brian Roberts (2e8) 4.97



[b:a1b3716189][u:a1b3716189]3B[/u:a1b3716189][/b:a1b3716189]
Mike Lowell (1e16) 2.51
Adrian Beltre (1e20) 2.87

Abraham Nunez (2e22) 3.27
Ryan Zimmerman (2e23) 3.07
Scott Rolen (2e15) 2.99
Jose Bautista (2e20) 2.92
Pedro Feliz (2e13) 2.91
Melvin Mora (3e14) 2.90
Aramis Ramirez (2e13) 2.87
Brandon Inge (2e20) 2.86
Nick Punto (2e12) 2.76
Alex Gordon (3e18) 2.74
Ty Wigginton (4e18) 2.74
David Wright (2e22) 2.73
Eric Chavez (2e11) 2.73
Josh Fields (4e19) 2.69
Casey Blake (3e17) 2.66
Troy Glaus (4e14) 2.52
Miguel Cabrera (4e25) 2.51
Chipper Jones (3e12) 2.51



[b:a1b3716189][u:a1b3716189]CF[/u:a1b3716189][/b:a1b3716189]
Ichiro Suzuki (1e1) 2.90
Torii Hunter (1e2) 2.68
Andruw Jones (1e2) 2.67
Aaron Rowand (1e2) 2.64
Grady Sizemore (1e2) 2.57
Vernon Wells (1e3) 2.29
Carlos Beltran (1e6) 2.87

Coco Crisp (2e1) 3.07
Curtis Granderson (2e6) 3.04
Melky Cabrera (3e5) 3.02
Nook Logan (2e4) 2.98
B.J. Upton (3e4) 2.91
Gary Matthews Jr. (2e6) 2.90
Hunter Pence (3e9) 2.83
Jacque Jones (3e6) 2.83
Willy Taveras (2e8) 2.76
Jim Edmonds (3e9) 2.74
Dave Roberts (3e5) 2.72
David DeJesus (2e4) 2.70
Jerry Owens (2e4) 2.65
Bill Hall (4e13) 2.64
Chris Young (2e7) 2.57
Mike Cameron (2e6) 2.52
Kenny Lofton (4e4) 2.52
Corey Patterson (2e4) 2.46
Juan Pierre (3e5) 2.35

[AeroDave10]

[quote:5b6aff89fd="sponedal"]may be more realistic then '07. Although in that set were the middle infielders more traditionally glove men?[/quote:5b6aff89fd]

I wish I knew for sure. I, nor even most SOM players, ever saw any of these guys in person, and since they weren't collecting defensive stats or filming games and showing highlights forever, it's hard to know for sure exactly how good these guys were. You can read biographies and newspaper accounts, but most of them are biased, particularly when it comes to superlative players.

[RICHARDMILTER]

SOM does 100 percent for sure talk to MLB scouts prior to their defensive ranking meetings! That is a fact, .....my friend!
As far as Franklin Guiterez goes, I saw every game he played in 2007, and a lot of the games twice, he was not a 1. I do not care what anyone says. Now as far as non Indians go,...my opinion does not mean much, because I do not see all their games. But when it comes to Guiterez's glove in 2007, he was letting balls fall in that I would have caught.

[AeroDave10]

Here are some of my guesses as to who SHOULD be a 1 in 2008, not necessarily who WILL be (2B/SS/3B/CF only):

[b:13371d809c][u:13371d809c]2B[/u:13371d809c][/b:13371d809c]
Mark Ellis
Brandon Phillips
Placido Polanco
Asdrubal Cabrera

[b:13371d809c][u:13371d809c]SS[/u:13371d809c][/b:13371d809c]
Troy Tulowitzki
Jack Wilson
Cesar Izturis

[b:13371d809c][u:13371d809c]3B[/u:13371d809c][/b:13371d809c]
Ryan Zimmerman
Adrian Beltre

[b:13371d809c][u:13371d809c]CF[/u:13371d809c][/b:13371d809c]
Carlos Gomez
Ichiro Suzuki
Aaron Rowand
Curtis Granderson
Corey Patterson
Carlos Beltran
Cody Ross



There could be a few others that I would understand, but this is my initial stab at it.

[keyzick]

OK, now to clarify, [i:6cc6cec0e7]I absolutely think there's value in actually viewing the players versus relying on statistics[/i:6cc6cec0e7], getting feedback from actual MLB scouts, etc. ...I'm just saying I don't think they have their own legion of hired scouts across the majors.

But I would like to see the scouts who are currently providing reports on the ATG sets...especially the deadball era!! :lol:

[Rant]

Ryan Zimmerman -- I watch Zimmerman fairly often, he's on the cusp of a one, but I'd still rate him a two. Same goes for David Wright.

Shane Victorino should get a one in center. He flat out covers ground, is a good general in the outfield, makes flashy plays, and just got a gold glove.

I don't see Torii Hunter enough, but I haven't heard of a really significant decline, so I'm inclined to give him a one. Same for G. Sizemore.

Jimmy Rollins is deserved of a one. Great range and a gun for an arm.

O. Hudson is a one at second from what I've seen. Injury shouldn't preempt that. I love Polanco, but I don't think he's a one.

Anyone watch Mike Aviles? SOM doesn't usually give ones out of the gate, but I hear he's got the stuff. I never saw him personally, so I won't hazard a guess.

[RICHARDMILTER]

Old TH said[quote:6848b0b07f]If Carlos Gomez does not get a "1", it will be an even bigger joke than Tulowitzki in 07. That guy gets to balls that no other OF (not even Torii Hunter himself) would get to.[/quote:6848b0b07f]


Old TH,
I may not always agree with you. But on this matter I do agree. The games I saw Carlos Gomez play, he was a 1!

As far as whether SOM uses MLB scouts; I know this to be a fact. They have a couple of their own guys scout. They look at the Gold Gloves. They look at ALL the defensive numbers. And they talk to MLB scouts from EVERY single ML team. And of all the factors the Gold Gloves, and defensive numbers mean the least, in their determination. Please read ,"Strat-O-Matic Fanatics" by Glen Guzzo,...if you do not believe me. Heck,..read it anyway, it is worth reading. Also, the real Hal Richman used to(and probably still does) have the final say in who gets what defensive number.
But I like it when the Strat players here debate as to who should get what range rating. So keep the comments coming. Thanks!

[keyzick]

Anyone who's a Sox fan can attest to the fact, yes fact, that Coco Crisp and Jacoby Ellsbury should both be 1's in CF next year. I'd venture Ellsbury might get a 1 in LF and 2 in RF as well.