let the jeter discussions begin

[Ninersphan]

The thing that gets me about the Jeter apologists, is that no one is disputing his leadership, the fact that he's a "winner" or the intangibles he brings to his team. All that was said was that his defense has slipped, noticibly. And that's true watch him play, he doesn't get to balls that others get to or that he used to get to, especially going to his left. If not for the ego's involved, he probably should have been moved to 2b and let A-rod play SS when A-rod came to the team. As much a Jeter has slipped, I still believe him to be a better fielder than Cano at 2b.

It will be interesting to see if Strat finally downgrades him to a 3, they are usually slow to react to these things though, so we'll have to see in a couple of months.

[Jerlins]

Have Jeter's defensive skills eroded? Certainly, but not to the point that he's even close to the worst in the league. Bill James had his 15 minutes of fame long ago, and his skills have eroded faster than Jeter. He needs to look no further than the SS on the team that gives him a paycheck to realize his analysis, for whatever reason, is faulty. As brilliant as Theo Epstein is, maybe he listened to James once too often in securing Julio Lugo to be their SS. Bill James might perform well in SOM, with all its statistics and probabilities, but evaluating talent on the field in real baseball is something best left to others. Baseball talent is and always has been judged by more than numbers and statisical oddities.

[RICHARDMILTER]

AeroDave10 said:[quote:76b409b5b1]
I don't think that position players in baseball can be labeled as "winners" because baseball really depends on so many individual efforts that one player (especially not the pitcher) controls so little of the game. That is evidenced by countless great players who have played on lousy teams and had very little or no playoff experience because the other guys on the team couldn't pull their weight. Along the same sentiments, successful baseball teams rely on the contributions of several individuals to winning championships[/quote:76b409b5b1]


Amen!

[harryweil]

[quote:3442ed0bc5="old__toriihunter"]

Kirby Puckett he is not.[/quote:3442ed0bc5]

Why no out cry on KB's roid use?

[bomberny50]

Makes the plays, gets to more balls, then most position players and shortstops, Don't know how the experts can come to this conclusion that he is the worst fielder.,

i think Strat has been a little unkind to him with there ratings and most certainly has almost never given me a great season with him.

In REAL life he would be my shortstop, unless of cousre Phil were still alive.

[Ninersphan]

[quote:1287ff248b="bomberny50"]Makes the plays, gets to more balls, then most position players and shortstops, Don't know how the experts can come to this conclusion that he is the worst fielder.,

i[b:1287ff248b] think Strat has been a little unkind to him [/b:1287ff248b]with there ratings and most certainly has almost never given me a great season with him.

In REAL life he would be my shortstop, unless of cousre Phil were still alive.[/quote:1287ff248b]


:shock: :?: :shock: :?:

Unkind Really???? the guys been a 2 or 1, when most of the rest of the Strat-o playing public thinks he should be a 3 (an average rating BTW) at best. Are you serious??? My god Jeter's rating is one of the reason's some people claim there is a Yankee bias to the game.

Again, no one is disputing his leadership abilities or his hitting or play in the clutch, but he simply does not have the range of other SS's, especailly going to his left.

[bomberny50]

Has anyone ever seen Jeter go to his right and jump up and throw guys out.???

has anyone ever seen him go after pop ups especially the catch against boston going into the seats.

Range??? I think he has range and is probably a 2. not a 1 , but certainly not a 4.

and i still would go with Phil if he were still alive.

[keyzick]

[quote:44dd09daff="bomberny50"]Has anyone ever seen Jeter go to his right and jump up and throw guys out.???[/quote:44dd09daff]

If he had better range he'd be able to get in front of it, plant, and throw, and wouldn't be so overrated.

[quote:44dd09daff="bomberny50"]has anyone ever seen him go after pop ups especially the catch against boston going into the seats.[/quote:44dd09daff]

He caught the ball, and then took 2-3 steps before falling into the stands.


I think he makes routine plays look great due to limited range, then having the NY media hype it to something supernatural. But to his credit, he is giving 110% effort on every play, ie, heart.

[LA Bear]

Captain Jeter is on his way out, The Yankees should have done this long ago, move AROD back to SS then find a thirdbasemen who can hit for power to backfill at 3rd. They've had a chance to fill one of the middle infileder positions with a temendous power hitter. They should take note of the data and move the bum sooner rather than later,while they can still get something for him.